Can you please clarify the rules on C4 jeeps for me?
I got warned tonight after several successful bomb runs even though i parked up next to the tank and ran before i blew it and so i didn't die. :blink:
GG all who played. :)
Tox
What's a C4 jeep? Do you load it up with C4 and park it somewhere with the keys in? Turn ignition and 'BOOOOOM!' Sounds good to me. :devil:
QuoteOriginally posted by Toxteth@Dec 20 2005, 11:11 PM
Can you please clarify the rules on C4 jeeps for me?
I got warned tonight after several successful bomb runs even though i parked up next to the tank and ran before i blew it and so i didn't die. :blink:
GG all who played. :)
Tox
[post=106277]Quoted post[/post]
Hi Tox,
What's frowned upon is driving at your target with a vehicle loaded with C4 with the intention of leaping out at the last minute and detonating. More often than not this tends to be a suicidal tactic which is why it's not allowed on our servers (you died twice trying this last night hence the warning).
What is allowed is 'road-side bombs' and booby-trapped vehicles.
Hope that clears it up.
OB
QuoteOriginally posted by Doorman@Dec 20 2005, 11:27 PM
What's a C4 jeep? Do you load it up with C4 and park it somewhere with the keys in? Turn ignition and 'BOOOOOM!' Sounds good to me. :devil:
[post=106281]Quoted post[/post]
I believe it's *normally* when people cover a jeep in C4 and then make suicide bomb runs at opposing armour. Bailing out and/or detonating at the last second to take out the armour.
True suicide runs are something that I think should result in a kick or ban. Driving up to the side of the vehicle, jumping out, and detonating, is *less* bad. But I still don't like it. I would have no problem with driving up to armour, throwing C4 on to the armour, and then running away and detonating, but having it on your jeep beforehand feels like a cheap trick that i'd rather not see used, even if it's not a true 'suicide run' cos you don't kill yourself.
just to add that you don't need to detonate or jump out to take out tanks with loaded jeeps. Drive straight into them, the resulting explosion takes out most things nearby.
ahem, what *not* to do :rolleyes:
QuoteOriginally posted by suicidal_monkey@Dec 21 2005, 12:01 PM
just to add that you don't need to detonate or jump out to take out tanks with loaded jeeps. Drive straight into them, the resulting explosion takes out most things nearby.
ahem, what *not* to do :rolleyes:
[post=106308]Quoted post[/post]
Ahem....
I am beginning to think that this is a bit too complicated... I have a couple of times rammed tankks or APCs with an APC. If I see that the armour is getting low, and that stepping outside of the APC would be true suicide, I have sometimes opted for ramming the other vehicle before it manages to blow me up.
Now, is this something that should result in a ban? If so, I'll never do it again. I swear.
:whistle:
QuoteOriginally posted by CoolHand@Dec 21 2005, 11:39 AM
I am beginning to think that this is a bit too complicated... I have a couple of times rammed tankks or APCs with an APC.
ramming per se is fine (imho - I do it too - managed to shove someone over a cliff before too :devil: ) but ramming a tank with a jeep
when the jeep is loaded with C4 results in the tank blowing up (along with everything else nearby) This is largely due to the C4 being detonated by the accident.
QuoteOriginally posted by suicidal_monkey@Dec 21 2005, 03:03 PM
ramming per se is fine (imho - I do it too - managed to shove someone over a cliff before too :devil: ) but ramming a tank with a jeep when the jeep is loaded with C4 results in the tank blowing up (along with everything else nearby) This is largely due to the C4 being detonated by the accident.
[post=106331]Quoted post[/post]
Ah.
Point taken.
I never used C4 anyway.
I find the issue of 'suicide' bombers in the game very interesting.
I often suicide bomb (Special Ops) - entirely because:
a) I get caught putting my C4 on so make the concious decision that if I am going to die I am taking YOU with me!
B) (More often) I don't get sufficiently clear before detonating my C4 (or get hit by flying debris).
Strangely no-one (as far as I know) has complained about me doing this (a) - and I think it is because they appreciate the risk I take trying to run up to a tank/APC in the open AND that many times I get caught and shot!
....In otherwords, there is a fair chance that my victim can do something about me...
The vehicle bomb however does not seem to give the victim a good chance to react and counter it.
It may be a fine line, but is sufficient to make the victim feel he wasn't given a FAIR chance to defend himself...
I think all of you have seen me running towards you at one time or another (and many of you have shot me doing it! LOL) - but there can be no comparison to the speed I run and the speed of a jeep coming toward you!
At least when I run toward you you can out run me by backing off speedily - there is no such chance when a speeding buggie or jeep comes toward you!
Please tell me if you think my 'suicide' bombing DOES niggle you - I'd find it interesting (just bear in mind that I NEVER scuicide bomb DELIBERATELY - it's just something that happens if I get caught).
Interesting note (and apologies for the stereotyping, no offence is meant) - but I feel perfectly happy suicide bombing when I play MEC or Chinese, as I think this 'realistic' and would actually happen. I feel less happy doing this when playing USMC. Funny eh?
QuoteOriginally posted by Ranger@Dec 21 2005, 01:37 PM
Interesting note (and apologies for the stereotyping, no offence is meant) - but I feel perfectly happy suicide bombing when I play MEC or Chinese, as I think this 'realistic' and would actually happen. I feel less happy doing this when playing USMC. Funny eh?
[post=106341]Quoted post[/post]
Nope. Thats just another wierd Ranger thing. Who is keeping the wierd Ranger list - is that in the private Charlie forum.
Ah ok, that's fair enough. Also i didn't realise that driving into enemy armour with C4 on blew you up which is why it seemed like suicide last night.
While we're on the point of clarifying things, i've been moaned about a few times for "bunny hopping" when i've been shot at from a distance or by enemy armour and so have jumped ONCE whilst on the run. Is this allowed or aren't you allowed to jump at all? (probably been brought up in a different post i've just missed it)
Thinking about it if someone shot at me in RL i doubt very much that id run and jump to try to escape...
Tox
That's something I use on publicservers but then more like boobytrap the driversseat, then see people enter it and KABOOM. Allways a big laugh for me because with one C4 you can take out the driver atleast.
QuoteOriginally posted by DuVeL@Dec 21 2005, 04:38 PM
That's something I use on publicservers but then more like boobytrap the driversseat, then see people enter it and KABOOM. Allways a big laugh for me because with one C4 you can take out the driver atleast.
[post=106382]Quoted post[/post]
Actually, this brings up a point...
Vehicle rape.
As a Spec Ops I can justifiably enter the UCB and blow up material...
Aren't vehicles in the UCB 'material'?
OR - is because people think it's 'low' to C4 a vehicle and wait for someone to get in before blowing it up...
I remember someone REALLY losing thier temper with me (not on the dMw server, btw) when I entered the UCB, C4'ed a F15, waited for the guy to take off, then - 'KABOOM!'.
So is it just sneaky and really low to boobie-trap someone's vehicle - OR is it 'cheating'?
And if it's 'cheating' - why is it ok to sneakily run up behind someone's vehicle and C4 it any other time?
Regards,
Confused, Scarborough
QuoteOriginally posted by big-paddy@Dec 21 2005, 02:30 PM
Nope. Thats just another wierd Ranger thing. Who is keeping the wierd Ranger list - is that in the private Charlie forum.
[post=106346]Quoted post[/post]
I'm NOT weird...
Just misunderstood!
R.
QuoteOriginally posted by Ranger@Dec 21 2005, 07:27 PM
Actually, this brings up a point...
Vehicle rape.
As a Spec Ops I can justifiably enter the UCB and blow up material...
Aren't vehicles in the UCB 'material'?
OR - is because people think it's 'low' to C4 a vehicle and wait for someone to get in before blowing it up...
I remember someone REALLY losing thier temper with me (not on the dMw server, btw) when I entered the UCB, C4'ed a F15, waited for the guy to take off, then - 'KABOOM!'.
So is it just sneaky and really low to boobie-trap someone's vehicle - OR is it 'cheating'?
And if it's 'cheating' - why is it ok to sneakily run up behind someone's vehicle and C4 it any other time?
Regards,
Confused, Scarborough
[post=106394]Quoted post[/post]
Setting booby-traps is allowed, right? Not?
QuoteOriginally posted by Ranger@Dec 21 2005, 05:27 PM
Actually, this brings up a point...
Vehicle rape.
As a Spec Ops I can justifiably enter the UCB and blow up material...
Aren't vehicles in the UCB 'material'?
OR - is because people think it's 'low' to C4 a vehicle and wait for someone to get in before blowing it up...
I remember someone REALLY losing thier temper with me (not on the dMw server, btw) when I entered the UCB, C4'ed a F15, waited for the guy to take off, then - 'KABOOM!'.
So is it just sneaky and really low to boobie-trap someone's vehicle - OR is it 'cheating'?
And if it's 'cheating' - why is it ok to sneakily run up behind someone's vehicle and C4 it any other time?
Regards,
Confused, Scarborough
[post=106394]Quoted post[/post]
Entering a UCB is not permitted here so that answers all UCB type queries. :P
When debating whether a particular tactic is right/wrong/sneaky/ethical I recommend that individuals ask themselves 'Is this good teamwork?'. In other words, are my actions those of a lone wolf or are they part of my teams agreed strategy? Planting C4 on a tank that's active in a live flagzone is good teamwork - it's good for the team. You hope to rid the enemy of a major asset as well as staying alive to support your team holding/attacking the flag. If, on the other hand, while this battle raged you were elsewhere trying to sneak C4 onto a currently unused asset then who are you helping?
An over simplification but I think it makes the point.
But of course every dMw member knew that because that's the dMw ethic.....right?
Right! :D
QuoteOriginally posted by Ranger@Dec 21 2005, 02:37 PM
Strangely no-one (as far as I know) has complained about me doing this (a) - and I think it is because they appreciate the risk I take trying to run up to a tank/APC in the open AND that many times I get caught and shot!
[post=106341]Quoted post[/post]
Well, you and I have talked about his that sunday we tried out teamwork. The evening before that sunday you blew the C4 several times very close, and once while standing right next to me.
I am going to be alone on this one, but I really don't see a problem wtih C4 runs in jeeps, if the person doing them can somehow survive. I rank it just as fair as running towards a tank and put C4 on it and run away - it is actually more difficult, since the jeep will give your position away, but I guess the advantage is that you can get close quickly. This puts more pressure on the tank driver I guess - because if he takes out the jeep while being close, I guess it will take him out as well. Fair enough imho. Puts more pressure on team work.
That said, if the player keeps suiciding while doing it, it is another matter. But hey, we all mess up - the other night I kep ramming Frenzy in our chopper duels, even though I hate when I do that - shit happens :)
QuoteOriginally posted by OldBloke@Dec 21 2005, 06:55 PM
Entering a UCB is not permitted here so that answers all UCB type queries. :P
When debating whether a particular tactic is right/wrong/sneaky/ethical I recommend that individuals ask themselves 'Is this good teamwork?'. In other words, are my actions those of a lone wolf or are they part of my teams agreed strategy? Planting C4 on a tank that's active in a live flagzone is good teamwork - it's good for the team. You hope to rid the enemy of a major asset as well as staying alive to support your team holding/attacking the flag. If, on the other hand, while this battle raged you were elsewhere trying to sneak C4 onto a currently unused asset then who are you helping?
An over simplification but I think it makes the point.
[post=106428]Quoted post[/post]
TA OB (my memory had it totally wrong - I thought SpecOps COULD enter an UCB...But on reflection that was Tactical Gamer! As we don't use a Commander, there is little point in destroying the UCB assets!).
:)
I know the score on our server, so I don't do it.
in the BF2 demo days, I was doing it often, and got it down to a fine art :devil:
I don't really find it that objectionable, providing of course that it's a "very recently arrived car bomb" and not a "suicide bomb"...accidents do happen :P
suiciding to take out enemies is sometimes a good tactical move eg. 2 enemy in a tank in the capture zone, all you team mates dead including SL, and the flags going down...
obviously you would rather survive, but to get close enough on foot is bad odds...so you detonate your C4 a bit early if they suss you or find a jeep and run into em :ph34r:
QuoteOriginally posted by OldBloke@Dec 21 2005, 08:55 PM
Entering a UCB is not permitted here so that answers all UCB type queries. :P
When debating whether a particular tactic is right/wrong/sneaky/ethical I recommend that individuals ask themselves 'Is this good teamwork?'. In other words, are my actions those of a lone wolf or are they part of my teams agreed strategy? Planting C4 on a tank that's active in a live flagzone is good teamwork - it's good for the team. You hope to rid the enemy of a major asset as well as staying alive to support your team holding/attacking the flag. If, on the other hand, while this battle raged you were elsewhere trying to sneak C4 onto a currently unused asset then who are you helping?
An over simplification but I think it makes the point.
[post=106428]Quoted post[/post]
I thought that it was permitted to enter the UCB to sabotage enemy vehicles and/or artillery.
Edit: I know now. I will correct my heretic thinking by lashing myself with boiled spaghetti.
QuoteOriginally posted by Ranger@Dec 21 2005, 05:28 PM
I'm NOT weird...
Just misunderstood!
R.
[post=106396]Quoted post[/post]
:narnar:
Me too!
QuoteOriginally posted by Doorman@Dec 21 2005, 09:21 PM
But of course every dMw member knew that because that's the dMw ethic.....right?
Right! :D
[post=106436]Quoted post[/post]
It does depends. On publicservers when I'm commander I will let a squad try and take out the enemies arty and so because it would help the team. Now for our own server I'd say: no.
QuoteThinking about it if someone shot at me in RL i doubt very much that id run and jump to try to escape..
Anyone else find that funny?
No?
Just me then.
I am not sure about this so it perhaps needs checking.
With Commander blowing up arty in UCB makes sense. I understand that spec ops even get points for this. Do those points represent a point loss to the other side? If they do then this is teamwork? When we dont have a commander, if these actions take points, is it still a worthwhile activity for the team?
One thing we need to remember is that we usually play a modded version of the game. Our rules are fine for that, but if we compete we need to have a better picture of where our ethics fit.
Denying the enemey aircraft through one player sat with c4 in their base could be seen as teamwork. Personally I dont support it. It isnt black and white though. An SL asking a player to go off alone, or agreeing to that is not lone wolfing - its an agreed strategy.
Ranger your right your reading was TG.
Perhaps we need to adopt some competition rules/ethics as well as everyday fun? then of course we would need to practice them.
To be honoust, if a SpecOp guys blows it up, it doesn't give alot of points. Also repairing arty and UAV and so doesn't give alot of points but according to me arty and UAV are a big help to the game (on publics).
I myself have destroyed loads of Arty/UAV but have also repaired it (when it was destroyed by the enemy) and you don't get loads of points for it. For destroying 1 UAV/Arty you get like 1 point for destroying an objective. For repairing UAV/Arty you get around 1 Repairpoint. It doesn't goes very fast for getting that Engineer/SpecOps badge and all it does help. On our servers it wouldn't really help.
I'm not sure if blowing up the arty/UAV of enemy lets them loose a ticket or so.
QuoteOriginally posted by Blunt@Dec 21 2005, 08:07 PM
obviously you would rather survive, but to get close enough on foot is bad odds...so you detonate your C4 a bit early if they suss you or find a jeep and run into em :ph34r:
[post=106448]Quoted post[/post]
Absolutely...
Basically, I try to run away - but when you see that turret turning towards you, well - it's 'Victoria Cross' time!
...Amusingly, there have been a couple of times when I have had no other choice because I have got myself 'stuck' between the tank/APC and another object!
The funniest one by far is when they spot you though and then start reversing fast - with me chasing them as fast as I can go! LOL
Dewey was telling me a funny one about this the other day - where he was a medic and got caught in teh open by a tank, so he pulled out a medi pack and ran towards teh tank...They only started reversing didn't they! LOL
I must admit I have noticed - when I have run out of C4 - that if a armoured vehicle sees that Spec Ops uniform they do have a tendency to be a bit 'chicken' and do a runner.
:)
i have played on a public and played in a squad called 'Spec Ops' and we had a full spec ops team to support the other two teams - surely its right for this team to take out all the commanders assets, and the planes - its their job.
We all must have seen countless films and read WW2 stories of commando raids and behind enemy lines activity taking out enemy vehicles and assets to support battlefield operations
QuoteOriginally posted by Boris@Dec 22 2005, 10:07 AM
... surely its right for this team to take out all the commanders assets, and the planes - its their job.
[post=106526]Quoted post[/post]
If that's what your team wants your squad to do then yes.
errr.... ok then!? :whistle:
i was never here, and you never saw me