RG1 had a open spot not so long ago. I app. for the spot, nothing secret in that.
After I talked with the officers about what to do as I was RL of RG2, we found a way to do it.
As I understod the contract:
I shoud continue RL for RG2 and follow then though MC, at that point I was taken as a RG2 defender / marshal.
When I raided with RG1, then I was taken as a guardian.
When I had done my job for leading RG2 though MC my job was done.
But lately I have had the idea that ppl think, that I am with RG1 in BWL to learn tacs, to lead them into it after.
But if the highlighted text is right, then there is diff. something that we need to talk about.
Now that RG1 closing in on killing nefarian and soon will move to AQ40 as I have heard so far, then the RG1 MC run will probely be changed to BWL and that will mean as I thought that I need to skip MC too and go with RG1 to BWL and that was I am out of RG2.
So now I woud love to know how you guys think all this is.
I think we do have a difference here Deadly. My recollections are as follows:
The issues:
RG1 needed another Mage
RG2 needed a good RL
The Guild needed a way to pass RG1 BWL experience and tactics down to RG2
The choice we faced was to invite a non-SoG Mage to RG1 and decline yoru application to RG1 or to kill two birds with one stone by inviting you to join us for BWL only to provide experience for RG2's future. This allowed RG2 to retain their RL for all MC/OL raids and prepared you to be RL for RG2 once RG2 they got into BWL by showing you the ropes with RG1 - otherwise RG2 lose their RL just as they enter a brand new and highly difficult instance and boss encounter.
Clearly we have a difference of opinion here. So where do you wish to be? RL or RG2 member? It is a decision for the Field Marshalls as to what is possible, but I think I am speaking for all of them when I say that we thought the agreement was to give you BWL experience to prepare you to lead RG2 into and through BWL (that's why I got you involved in the adds targeting after Vaelestraz in BWL 3 weeks ago, it was to show you how to do it for RG2, not for RG1).
This is not necessarily locked in stone, but we do need to discuss further to confirm what everyone wants out of this.
TL.
I would personally be sad to see Deadly leave RG2 as a leader. But to retain him in RG2, we need to look a bit closer to the way RG2 runs maybe?
I would love to see RG2 as a real raid group, meaning;
That we have a rule of attendance for Defenders
We function more like RG1
Beeing a real RG2, not a casual raidgroup.
This will make us more like RG1 and I think we will progress better this way, and this will also mean greater challenge for Deadly as RL and us others Marshalls.
I also would like to say, if this happens we Marshalls RG2 have to take more control over RG2.
But most important - What are you mostly hocked on Deadly?
QuoteBut lately I have had the idea that ppl think, that I am with RG1 in BWL to learn tacs, to lead them into it after.
This wasnt my conclusion, but a lot of the other officers thought that. Whats really interesting is what YOU want to do, not the other way around
If you mostly want to raid with RG1, and not have too much affiliation with RG2, then we should change the raid leader for RG2 pretty soon. Most people are seeing Deadly as the primary raid leader and the experience and focus he has, we have no other (except officers) who actually has that knowledge and commitment.
I think we should find out what Deadly wants in the future, and try to separate RG1/RG2 even more making them a raid group by themselves allthough still helping them all we can so they dont feel left out
Well all this time I have thought that Deadly was gonna lead RG2 into BWL after getting experience in RG1, but that was maybe just me? :(
And ye, Saz, Deadly leaving would be sad :(
As I said in the start of the thread.
My intension was to go from RG2 to RG1, without having problem in helping RG2 as long both groups do MC thursday.
That was allso why I asked for more ppl to lead the raid, all back from the start of all this.
But from the reposts here it look abit like I am the bad link here. So maybe I just shoud shut up now and see what happens in the future.
This maybe sound abit tough. But thought I made my self clear from the start.
QuoteI think we should find out what Deadly wants in the future, and try to separate RG1/RG2 even more making them a raid group by themselves allthough still helping them all we can so they dont feel left out
/agree 110% Padding.
QuoteOriginally posted by Bastet
Deadly has been half moved up to RG1 for BWL tactics, so that once RG2 gets to the level where they can do BWL (roughly when MC can be done in arround 4-5 hours, or 1 night) hes familiar w/ the tactics and able to explain everything to you
This is from a topic in the Raid forum.
What do you want Deadly, what is your goals...... can you clarify that?
Well as Padding knows that we discussed whether or not to put some distance between RG1 & RG2 last night in the Field Marshall channel and that we reached a conclusion. As the wording has yet to be signed off I won't say anything more until the announcement is made by Vargen.
Back to Deadly. When the proposal was made (I made it myself on Teamspeak although I believe another Officer was in the channel too, Bastet maybe?) I thought I had made the offer clear, I obviously did not. Having made the agreement though it is important for Deadly to know that it is not cast in stone. Deadly, you need to get out of SoG membership and raiding the bits that you enjoy. If it isn't floating your boat then say so and we'll make changes.
What SoG need is to build a solid RG2 with a high quality group of leaders, each capable of taking RG2 through both MC and OL and clearing them each week. The leaders also need to be sufficiently experienced and tactically aware to then take the raid through BWL too.
That's the role we thought we had filled.
If Deadly decides to stay with RG2 (whether as RL or not) then his RG1 time will come to an end when RG2 go to BWL.
If Deadly wishes to move to RG1 full time and drop the RG2 RL role then we need to plan for it, put the right people in place, train them up to allow them to take over the management of RG2 and allow Deadly to step away.
Everything is possible.
TL.
From the start is was very clear what Deadly's role was. It was written in many topics by different officers and you really could not misunderstand it imo.
I really hope Deadly will continue in RG2! :)
QuoteFrom the start is was very clear what Deadly's role was
Apparantly we did, so that means it wasnt clear enough, or we are fools, and i'd like to think the first thing. Anyways, lets deal with the discussion now and hear what deadly wants and act accordingly
Apperantly there was a huge error in comunication, weather on our side or on yours doesnt really matter at all, what does matter is working out how we can straight that error. If thats you stepping up full time to RG1, or to RG2 raid leading doesnt make much differance for me personaly, allthough the first might be a bit harder to organisze in the longer run. So its mostly up to you to decide what you want.
Personably i am very sorry about this, and will promisse to do my best to help come up with a solution that works for all of us!
dont know how to really answar this atm. I will try to catch padding if posible as he is danish too.
Maybe he can help me make the words sound in the right way and give all of this a sentence.
Aye, we'll wait to hear back from you later tonight, I think we probably need a Teamspeak session I am guessing.........
TL.
I'll be on later.... feel free to catch me there anytime
Ok, i've just talked to deadlyspirit on TS and my initial views on the matter was correct
Deadlyspirit is ex-NG and a lot of his friends was from that guild. Thats one of the reason he wanted to help the guys in Molten Core. That said, he is always striving to raid the most possible and thats why he wants to come with us in BWL to kill the hardest bosses and try the big instances.
Deadlyspirit would still like to help out the most he can, but he is not particularly interested in leading RG2 through BWL. He may just help out, but that would be on his own account not taking his time away from RG1.
With the above in mind, we need to find some new raidleaders to lead RG2 through Molten Core and BWL in the future and slowly transition Deadlyspirit to be a full RG1 member
/agree padding we had a good talk
Well now thats clear we need to work on a plan of action in how to make the transition as smooth as possible, and i hope we can all appreciate that it will take a bit longer then what we might want. A TS conversation between all of us officers and marshals might not be a bad idea.
In some way I'm disappointed, and I know others are too :(
But this means we need to find another RL, and I see nobody in RG2 who can take over the spot really.
I think you should reconsider this Deadly. Remember that you build up this raidgroup and we are on our way to conquer new instances! The groups members are counting on you and think youre a great leader to have and believe youre the right person to lead exactly our raid group!
Your saying you want to raid more days. Maybe RG2 will do this in the future - and I think they will as soon as we start in BWL.
If you decide to leave to RG1, then I think RG2 will have problems for quite some time :(
Done is done Mazii, and so be it.
Lets flip this on the positive side.
So if I understand correct Deadly will still lead RG2.... but for how long? - As I see it he needs to lead untill at least ALL CL are found, so we have a full Marshall base to work from.
We still need 3 class leaders + Deadlys spot.
When this is done, we have to look on who's up to the RL positions, and slowly "teach" how to do it. People like Siffredi, Mazii, Greatdanes and Me are getting the hang of it, but still has some way to go.
Id also like to keep Deadly untill we get RG2 made a "real raidgroup" with a base of good players. (attending players)
A great challenge is ahead for RG2, lets make the transition smooth and without to many bumps.
To add a few words.
Through the time we have had in MC so far, I have tryed to learn the now marshals some things on the runs and I woud say we have talked outside raids too if any questians.
Ofc I know that was easyere as we all knew each other and all still using Ventrillo, to hold contact.
If it goes as my head says, I will be there to help out RG2 for some time still and got pleanty of time to learn you guys what I know.
As a little note. I did not have intension on bieng the RL from the start. Yes I had applyed as a class leader, and then got a tip about there where nobody that had signed up for RL spot. So thought somebody had to do it and I took the chance and made a apply for it.
And Mazii it is totaly wrong what you say that there is nobody in the RG2 team that can be a good RL.
But looking forward for the TS talk.
I didnt say that nobody in RG2 can be a good RL, I'm just saying atm there is noone in RG2 who would like to be RL, and that a problem.
I think that Deadly have the right to follow up on his own ambitions, and should go into RG1, when RG2 have a new RL that will take over. I know that myself will try to partly control raid when possible, however i do not have the time to study massively on tactics for BWL. Because i have a fairly newborn child that needs my attention. However perhaps active ppl on TS like Spi and others could be considered as trying to learn the tactics for MC/BWL to the buttom?
I wish you the best luck in RG1 when the time comes :D