As many of you probably have seen, I can no longer raid monday nights. That means I only can join thursdays raids for RG2 and I really can't see myself only raiding MC.
Therefore I have made the decision to leave the guild and find another one whos raid scheldue fits me better. I have found that in Equanimity.
I don't hope any of you are mad at me, as this should be pretty understandable.
I still wish to be friends with you all and join some of your kickass PVP teams as it really rocks :devil:
The time in RG2 have been the best time ever raidingwise for me, and it was fun learning new encounters and taking down new bosses in such a short time! GL in the future RG2! I really think you will take down Vael really soon! And also a big GL to RG1 in AQ40 :)
Cya all ingame! :smile:
Bummer to see you leave, but understand your reasons....goodluck mate....
Gl
/p
cya mate!
well before leaving u could try to apply as RG1 member it might fit more your gaming days and u'll still be in the guild i'd rly like to c u still in SoG
Quote from: Asheera;146160well before leaving u could try to apply as RG1 member it might fit more your gaming days and u'll still be in the guild i'd rly like to c u still in SoG
Wot he said.
Seems a shame that a former Marshall fails to speak to his colleagues about options before taking what he admits is a fairly big decision. :thumbsdown:
Time and time again we say it - don't be an idiot, please speak to the Field Marshalls and Marshalls *before* taking uninformed decisions. The stupid thing is that if Mazii had actually done this the muppet might have found a solution was available. :angry:
We all recognise people's lives change over time, circumstances, jobs and available time all change, but for goodness sake people, discuss things with us before jumping off the cliff. If I suddenly found I could no longer raid Tuesdays do you think it would be sensible for em to /gquit and then find a new Guild that doesn't raid Tuesdays? Or perhaps do you think that anyone would an ounce of common sense would talk to the officers about options before doing anything at all?
Mazii, you're a nice guy but you're acting like a bloody prat and making yourself look stupid. Sorry, but it's true. Come talk to us if you have not thrown out *all* the grey matter.
TL.
Yes I still read the forums until my rights gets changed. So I just wanted to inform you about that I actually did talk to a Field Marshal.
I wanted to try something new which I also told the Field Marshal I talked to eventhough he did offer me a RG1 spot. I didnt think it was fair after what I heard what some people said about Luminance joining RG1.
Quote from: Mazii;146164I didnt think it was fair after what I heard what some people said about Luminance joining RG1.
Jayzus Mazii, the first thing the FMs knew about this was at 9.51pm last night, so I hardly think that it qualified as a discussion as we've only just found out about it and you've already gone. Even then we only heard via what was reported to us as a rumour, not hard discussion about anything. So you've not exactly given us a chance to discuss anything have you!
As for your comment about what others said: you listened to them? :blink: Duh!
Fair? I think not. You should have come talked to us Mazii, that would have been fair, but you didn't. The TS server is there 24/7, you know I *always* make myself available to Guildies who want to ask something, to talk about something and none of us have had a chance to do that with you.
That's seriously disappointing and I expected more of you given your previous role as Marshall and yoru knowledge of the way we work as officers for the Guild.
TL.
I told Padding last night I would decide what to do today and he was very understanding.
I didn't listen to them, but I know if I were in a guild with people who couldnt stand me because they thought I used it to just get an upgrade, I just couldnt stand that. There might be some but atleast I dont have to hear them bitch over it.
I thought this was the best thing to do, and I hope nobody are mad at me and we can still talk to eachother ingame.
well, that is not the best thing to do, that is imho the worst..
if ppl whine, let them whine..
from my pov you betrayed the trust ppl had in you..
Quote from: Mazii;146170I told Padding last night I would decide what to do today and he was very understanding.
Be assured, I *am* mad at you Mazii.
Mad because you gave us, SoG, the Officers and the other members absolutely ZERO chance to help you. And that really sucks - it says a lot about what you think of us.
The message we got from Padding was not "I'm going to decide tomorrow" and I can assure you that your discussion with Padding (which was reported to us at 9.51pm last night) did *not* give Padding that impression either.
Next time you pull a stunt like that i hope it blows your nuts off. Give people a chance to help you Mazii, because you didn't give us any chance at all - and how do you think that makes us feel?
TL.
QuoteI told Padding last night I would decide what to do today and he was very understanding
This is wrong. I wasnt understanding, i was trying to get Mazii to consider staying in the guild. That can hardly be seen as understanding. As i also told Mazii, i see his move as a move down the career slope for him, but talking to him, i felt there was no possibility for Mazii to stay and apparantly Mazii wanted to move more than fighting to stay.
I think Mazii will regret his move in a few months, but thats my opinion
Thanks for the vote of confidance :thumbsdown:
As a bonus, we get to wave goodbye to a certain legendary hammer that the Guild just helped create. :(
TL.
It's ok your mad, TL. But I did tell Padding that I would give him an answer today, and he told me that it would take 1 week to discuss the things on your private forum.
Thats all that happened. Have fun guys.
Thanks for the reassurance. I'll cancel my appointment with my counsellor.
TL.
This is my opinion and not related to my position as a FM.
First of all less then 1 day to consider doesnt rly help does it?
2nd You just got a legendary which SOG helped create and you got a shitload of mats for it (which is about 6-7K G Ah value wise). I must say i am pretty tempted to send you a bill for those mats not to mention a ultra rare drop you "stole" from SOG.
Lunares
Very sad to see you leave, especially after reading above posts. Have fun in your new guild, but as most people do, i will be looking forward to see you come crawling back in a couple of weeks...
Thierry
Quote from: lunares;1461872nd You just got a legendary which SOG helped create and you got a shitload of mats for it (which is about 6-7K G Ah value wise).
That's worth highlighting
6,000 - 7,000 Gold :ranting2:
TL.
Just wanted to make one thing clear that this wasnt planned as I were happy in RG2. And "just" because I got the hammer (out of 3 that whispered, were one allready left) I'm not free to do anytihng....? I can see it from your point of view, but trying seeing it from mine. I still want to raid - not only MC - but especially BWL.
Send me a bill whatever, I will send all my gold to you and all other things that are worth something, just aslong as you will stop making me feel guilty that I whispered on it - which isnt fair.
The friends I made in SoG will still be my friends whether im not theres or not.
It's not about the hammer, or the worth of the mats. We gave it to exactly you because we trusted you.
It's not about you leaving either. It IS however about leaving without even giving us a chance.
The Hammer and you leaving are not linked, but it sure didn't make you any more loyal to the Guild now did it. :(
Legendaries are special, we think carefully about who to give them to and you wer epart of the discussion on officer channel about who should get it. It sucks that you feel no obligation to the Guild to allow us to help you.
Quote from: Mazii;146195I still want to raid - not only MC - but especially BWL.
Send me a bill whatever, I will send all my gold to you and all other things that are worth something, just aslong as you will stop making me feel guilty that I whispered on it - which isnt fair.
RG2 do BWL you know? So do RG1. Equanimity are at about the same point us us in AQ40. So you want to raid and you have friends here? Why not have talked to us - or are we not that important?
Guilty? Yes I hope it does make you realise how let down we feel by you Mazii. We feel abused, we feel taken advantage of, we feel that we your so-called friends were given were given no opportunity to help you and talk to you. You never bothered, you did not care about us one iota. That sucks. And it stings all the more when we dig deep into Guild Bank to provide you with that many materials.
Enjoy the Hammer Mazii. And think of us when you use it - and your stupidity in not talking to us before announcing a jump to another Guild to get better loot.
TL.
Quote from: Mazii;146195Just wanted to make one thing clear that this wasnt planned as I were happy in RG2. And "just" because I got the hammer (out of 3 that whispered, were one allready left) I'm not free to do anytihng....? I can see it from your point of view, but trying seeing it from mine. I still want to raid - not only MC - but especially BWL.
You say look from your side. I did and i cant understand you left after giving us the change of 12 YES 12 WHOLE hours to look at it which was in the evening so less hours of time to think about it. You are free to do anything but i for 1 am very disappointed in you and the way you behaved. 1 Time no raid and a few times bad attendance and you say i cant raid anymore in SOG?????? Shame i expected more from you like common sense.
Lunares
Quote from: Mazii;146055Cant play monday anymore.
\\Mazii
Now I tell you what will be interesting. Mazii - I got your alt names and your main name (and so do your 'friends' in SoG). I'll be tracking via my Friends list to see if you play Monday nights. I wonder what will happen.......
TL.
I think it is a stupid thing you do Mazii.
You got your hammer, you got a shitloads of epics - but what I think you might not deserve is the hands the ppl in SoG are reaching out to you, the ppl wanting to solve the problem you have by not being able to raid tuesdays.
You might become the "Oooh and Ahhh" of you new guild for a while, but the "Ooohs and Ahhhs" soon fade away. By then you will come to miss what you had in SoG, respect.
It isnt that the Guild owns you sice they equipped you with your gear - but you owe SoG you loyalty and to give SoG a chance to help you before doing such a selfish thing.
(oh, and btw, you got the speedbuff in wsg and took the berserkerbuff from me :taz: )
QuoteSend me a bill whatever, I will send all my gold to you and all other things that are worth something, just aslong as you will stop making me feel guilty that I whispered on it - which isnt fair.
So its fair of you quitting the guild after you "took" alot of epix & Legendary's? You shouldnt feel guilty because you took the hammer, But you should feel guilty because you left with the hammer.
Addy says it perfectly, have fun in Equa, get some epix etc. But you will never get the respect you had in sog, and i doubt you'll get the rank you had also. From my POV you had a great time here, but well you fu'ked up.
Tl said it also, hope you loose your nuts next time:)
First of all you people saying he owed you more of a notice so you could look at it more. No he didn't it is his choice not yours and it shouldn't matter if he gave you 1hour or 50days it is HIS choice not yours.
He was decent, he told you why he was leaving and he gave you a notice before he left. And people saying we could have gotten you to RG1, so what? Maybe he doesn't want to join RG1. Do you know all the variables? do you know how often Equanimity raids? maybe they raid 5days a week but not mondays and he wants to raid more.
You talk about him having friends in the guild, he might have friends other places as well and maybe even closer friends. Also last time i knew he had almost as many enemies as friends in the guild and left, and you all owe him something for actually coming back just because you asked him to come back.
As far as i am concerned i look as mazii as a good player and a person i always liked in the guild even though i didn't have alot of contact with him. He earned his epics and the legendery with raiding, leading the paladin class and doing solid work for the guild. Only thing he owes you is a decent goodbye and after your reactions it seems you weren't even worth it and he should just have left with a **** YOU ALL without notice.
Quote from: Drazila;146211Only thing he owes you is a decent goodbye
Touche, Tenilia. We kind of felt it was a two-way street, not a one-way railroad.
People make their own choices you're right, he can quit when he wants, but the depth of feeling posted here is testiment to the hurt people feel over the way he chose to do things - and that's the bit that hurts - that's the bit that he had control over.
TL.
Very Cold and Cool Drazila.
He can do whatever he feels like. It is a game. But when you start playing in a guild, you dont interact with NPCs. You play with humans. And they care.
you write like you are a film critic. fine, you dont give a **** about most things and are negative everything when it comes to guild stuff (right?). You are like kind of neutral here, and that is good. But I think ppl that posted here are also emotionally engaged in the matter.
So, thumbs up for Drazila for writing what he said. But one thumb down for writing it (because he knew...) knowing that here are ppl somewhat hurt and/or offended by him leaving.:clap: :thumbsdown:
Quote from: Adularena;146217But I think ppl that posted here are also emotionally engaged in the matter.
Well i might be neutral in that i didn't know mazii very well but i am not neutral since i am a guild member and have been since the guild was founded. And i am very offended by the way the officers react. If a friend of mine said he was leaving because he couldn't do what he wanted here and he would still have contact then i would say goodbye and good luck not throw dirt on him and blame him for not being able to help me anymore.
Quote from: Drazila;146218And i am very offended by the way the officers react.
So you want us to say ok cya around and thats it. The officers arent machines and i might have overreacted there but i still mean what i said at that time. As an officer you allready dont have much freedom to say what you think. And from that post we just need to say ok cya. Well i cant and i wont, most of the time i restrain myself.
Lunares
Damn Mazii this was something I didnt see coming. And I cant really say Im happy about hearing your decision but it's yours and I (we) gotta respect that. Its a shame that you cant stay in SoG but I hope that Ill see you around in the battlegrounds :biggrin:
And about the epics and his hammer he got, he earned them for the work he did, not the work he will do!
Still I wish you the best of luck in Equanimity!
Thing was, he didnt know if he could do what he wanted, if he asked he MIGHT have got the slack he needed. MAzii didnt ask or check the options before he left. Thats all.
Like your gf breaking up with you not teling you what was wrong. Wouldnt it be wise to see if the two could sort it out?
/the reason why I use Mazii and "GF" in this analogy (if it thats the word) is because HE SNATCHED THE, lol, BERSERKER BUFF in front of me, lol/
And his hammer, I own it a bit too, though I dont care.
Quote from: Drazila;146218not throw dirt on him and blame him for not being able to help me anymore.
....which shows you have not read the posts very well Tenilia. That's not the bit we're annoyed by, it's the lack of discussion and opportunity to help. At the end of the day we may nto have been able to help, but you know what - we just *might* have been able to do so. The trouble is that now we'll never know.
TL.
you may be sour at him and say that as you want but the officers may not act like persons that own everyone in the guild and you have all basicly said that it is the officers choice not your own choice to leave.
This is a goodbye thread and you could have just said goodbye i am sad to see you leave. Goodbye i didn't expect this from you or Goodbye i hope you realise this is the wrong decision. But no you all had to come and basicly flame him for his decision instead of saying goodbye like most people that aren't officers have done in this thread.
It might be that he didn't think of all the possibilities and as he pointed out he did consider the RG1 spot that was offered to him but again everyone is better at throwing dirt at people than to congratulate them at going forward so that would have been just as bad, just the members not the officers flaming. Maybe there even is more to him leaving then just what he said, he said he expected this if he joined RG1 and maybe he expected it from him leaving also and you just proven him right and he doesn't want to stay with you all because you react this way.
And he isn't the first person to think about leaving for another group and few that have thought of it had as good a reason as he has. Warsshan is in Righteous and he was here alot longer then mazii has been, Vargen has been offered a spot in Righteous RG1 numerous times and he considerd it often though lesser the more offers he got. Kreuz applied for Righteous numerous times and was turned down, when he finally was offered a spot he said no. Ragnarh was offerd a MT1 spot when Righteous RG2 was starting he said no almost right away. I am guessing some other officers have gotten offers and most have considerd them. Now most of this happend when i was still a raid leader for RG1 and i would have been sour at them and i have a lot more right to that than you all have at mazii but i would still have been decent and said goodbye, i might have tried to talk them out of it and i actually did talk my brother out of it i think. But not publicly and definetly not by trying to guilt them into staying.
Lastly i want to point out to you all that Irulan a former guild leader and a person i basicly did all the instances in the game and leveled with from 20-60 left in a similar way for Righteous. I still respected his choice even though i might not be happy to see him leave.
Good luck Mazii, have fun in Equanimity, they're a nice bunch so im sure you'll fit right in :)
Quote from: TeaLeaf;146225....which shows you have not read the posts very well Tenilia. That's not the bit we're annoyed by, it's the lack of discussion and opportunity to help. At the end of the day we may nto have been able to help, but you know what - we just *might* have been able to do so. The trouble is that now we'll never know.
TL.
Some were sour because he didn't talk to you, some brought up the legendery and talked about that. Some were decent enough to say goodbye and some basicly flamed him. But likei said in my post before, he may not have considered all possibilites and he did consider joining RG1 wich is the most reasonable solution. But people here have proven what he basicly was afraid of would happen if he took some offer from the officers.
Just wanting to say goodbye to Mazii, sad to see you go mate, hope you have a good time over there.
Quote from: Drazila;146232But people here have proven what he basicly was afraid of would happen if he took some offer from the officers.
Oh really? Tenilia - you know us better than that and the accusation sucks. We put in an immense amount of effort to help members, to develop their skills and their progress, we try to make it the best guild for members that we can. So the lack of opportunity to discuss problems, especially with a former officer is the bit that smarts.
Yes I wish him well, yes I am angry about the way he chose to depart, but just as he has the right to do whatever he so pleases with his account, I feel the right to point out the effort that has been given to him by the officers and the feelings caused when he does not even give us a chance to help a fellow Guild member.
Decisions like this do not come overnight. There was a chance to talk, an opportunit to help, we did not get the chance to contribute and imo have every right to feel agrieved about that bit.
TL.
That quote wasn't directed directly at the officers but at the guild as a whole. I expect a flame everytime someone leaves, moves between a group or gives an opinion that isn't common believe. I might have gone a little off topic in my last posts and gone over to the general atmosphere on these forums.
The officers do alot of work, some work they do that isn't needed and some could be done alot easier by talking to the members. It isn't easy to see the diffrences and some work that isn't needed has to be done just to see it isn't needed. But expecting anything else then a notice about a member leaving is over doing it. If he had wanted your opinion, suggestions or solutions he would have come to you and asked for them. as Padding posted on the first page mazii seemed to not want to fight for staying, if he did want it he would have contacted you and you shouldn't expect every person that is going to leave to look for an alternative solutions from the officers. You got a notice about him leaving before he left and padding did pick up on the part where other solutions weren't wanted. You shouldn't expect everyone that is leaving to want your contribution and be glad for those that want your contribution.
But the biggest reason why i don't raid anymore and haven't raided for a while is because of the atmosphere outside the raids. It can be fun in the raid, guild chat and TS but most things that are posted on these forums except for the Off topic section is extremely negative. People seem to complain about systems that might seem important but aren't really. The DKP system gets a hosing every 2months, the rank system every 3months, a member leaves every month and he usually gets a hosing also. And if you think the new DKP system is great just because noone has said anything about it yet you will soon get people that don't like that fact that they get no reward for doing AQ40 since no items they want drop there. It was a good solution to give 5% from the other instances to a new system but there will still be people that whine as there have always been.
Well first of all goodbye Mazii, it is ashame to see you leave, I'd have liked to have said my farewell to you in guild.
Second, I don't really want to get too involved in the rest of what's going on here so...
Please Teni (and others who no doubt agree with you) keep in mind that Mazii was effectively an Officer for RG2 and did have some responsibilities, as those responsibilities aren't enshrined in any code I'm not going to make any fight over it (I might as well be a lawyer fighting over the British Constitution). Also when Irulan left, that had been coming for months, afterall he had been raiding with Righteous pretty much since the start.
Second for everyone else on the so-called flamer side, look we have had a lot of ppl leave lately and I realise nerves are running hot, Mazii prob chose just about exactly the wrong moment to leave in that respect but that isn't his fault. I think really some other peeps deserve twice as much flaming especially those departing RG1 in times of need. I realise he had Officer responsibilities, and those need to be discussed properly. It would be a good idea if Mazii apologises for the abruptness of his departure, but little else would do any possible good now.
What I'd like to suggest is that there are some serious issues to be debated here especially about loyalty and liability to the guild, at the moment these are grey areas which appear to depend upon everyone's personal view on the matter. These issues should be moved onto a seperate thread whilst a bucket of ice should be chucked over this one before we cause any kind of further rift amongst guild members which can only really result in further departures that may prove even more detrimental to RG1's Naxx efforts.
Anyways if you're still feeling a little hurt pop down to the pub and enjoy a good pint in a beer garden :happy: (unless if you're underage - then you had better make that a shandy :tongue:). If you're anywhere near London, I'll even take you out for a drink :biggrin:!
Shep
(& Bambewhistle)
PS If anyone has issues about this post pls take them up with me, I'll be back online on Tuesday. I don't want to *contribute* to this thread any further.
i will keep myself neutral here.. and say bb mazii and have fun out there.
short and simple.
BB Mazii... Ill catch you on my friendslist.
Why dont we just close this thread?
I'll crawl to the cross and say Bye Mazii.
Theres always something negative with someone leaving, kinda worse when Mazii was an officer, and from the things i know he didnt talk it out, like every single officer in this guild has stated.
Oh, and im so gutted teni. GUTTED!
Look at my quote an think a bit about it ;)
At the end of the day, he did very well when he was in SoG, and contributed greatly to the guild. Its a game, he can make his own decisions, and do as he wishes, and I dont have a problem with him doing whatever makes him happy. So no more **** talking about him, and wish him good luck.
Someday there will be a time when someone leaves, and you know that just saying goodbye wont be enought to make the person come back. What TL did here was to reach out and try to grab hold of his hand and force him to think it over.
Think of the Humphrey movie, the goodby was "here is looking at you, kid". But sometimes you need to act, and he TL did! I`m sure that Mazii would be upset/somewhat aggroed by it, but I think it could have helped the person to think twice.
But ofc, the officers cant help someone that doesnt want to be helped.
And what is better than a Hosing, a real good hosing!? Thats communication you know.
I am shock over you goodbye, Mazii but have seen you done this before so overall a natural thing from you. :byebye:
Hmm, sorry to see you go mazii, but its your choise, and even though i dont agree one bit, i still wish you good luch in eq.
Hope you can find what you seek in new guild Mazii. :eyebrow:
i don't agree this guild leave so much, anyway this is better then Menethil expaining!
crybabies.. The atmosphere in this guild has taken a toll for the worse.. :thumbsdown:Now I'm glad i'm a soldier... gits...
gl Mazii. Have fun..
Quote from: Ubar;146317anyway this is better then Menethil expaining!
huh? :blink:
Tinilgawiel (http://www.deadmen.co.uk/forum/member.php?u=812)
Nothing to do with crybabyies, i understand TL and the other marshall's very well..
It's allways sad to loose a member and even more without talkting things trought with them.
But Mazii isent just anyone, hes a member, commerade and a friend. A marshall that had respect and friends. And when a person just leaves without talking about it and in such short notice there must be more behind that Mazii maby doesent want to talk about. Who knows?
But GL Mazii, and hope you find a bit of common sense to think things trough, and take a talk with TL and the other marshall's of what happend that night.
But we'll meet again if not in SoG then fraghunting horde ;)
// Yrthal
Just so peeps know, as of just now Mazii no longer has access to the SOG section. I left the access there for a while in some vain hope.
TL.
I would think a lock is in place than. This was his saying goodbye thread and not a discussion thread imo.
Quote from: Sebas;146339I would think a lock is in place than. This was his saying goodbye thread and not a discussion thread imo.
Yeah I have to agree. I think all has been said, and there's also some stuff to keep in mind from this post.