Well what happend tonight was i asked Grimaid and Aipril to make a macro about "swapping" when we recive the debuff so we know when to pop out to heal the MTs Aipril didnt replay to Priest channel (which he never does on any of RG2 runs) so i assumed he know what to do when i wispered him he sad yes i understand,well we did Firemaw fight Wierd who was the one to recive the whisper from Aipril when to swapp never did so,this caused some confussion between me and grimaid.When the fight was over i asked Aipril in Priest channel he replayed by telling us " u shouldnt even consider telling me what to do on a boss fights becuse i know them allrdy."
My replay was "Well then u can actually do it your own way cause i dont care about u or the way u do your healing since u dont replay on priest channel we dont know what to hell we should excpect from u, we dont even know if u buff the groups u are asked to buff."
Wierd!
Like I see him, he is not a team player but wants only to do what he wants in raid and that is frustrated for a class leader in the long terms. So I think we should get a replacement for him.
But btw about he have found a spot where he don't get any debuffs, that's true - I was keeping a eye on him and he did stand in a spot where he was able to heal without getting any debuffs, thats why he could use he's mana so fast as he did.
If he is right about such a spot then we should listen to him because all the priests and casters could stand there...
You can't attack from the spot, I was trying to do so, but he could heal the tanks from it.
Well he has no spot in our raid in TBC!
Allthough he dont strike me as paticulary bright atm, saying that might be a tad over the top. Your FM, whiter then white and such
It's one of the tougher parts of being an FM is the responsibility it remain level-headed and cool at all times. Aipril clearly acted like a prick imo (I was stood next to him during Firemaw and saw his 3 or 4 requests for an innervate and wondered what the hell he was doing - spam healing was the answer. (Yes that's him asking for 3 or 4 separate innervates, not asking for one inervate 3 or 4 times).
I think Aipril's action was wrong and our response to him could have been worded better.
Wierd, what might help is if you could provide some sort of brief summary of the things he has been doing wrong over recent reaids that you have had to bring his attention to during raids and his response to those issues. IF the list is impressive it mitigates somewhat the response he received. We can then try to formulate some sort of offical reply.
TL
Aiprils list of mistakes/actions:
1: Never listens to wierds commands, and never answers to him or anything in the priest channel eventhough he is in this channel. Does not reply on whispers usually from Wierd either.
2: Is not a teamplayer, as its impossible to get anything though to him, and he has on several occations not turned up without saying on forums. We have given him a warning and a serious talk earlier where he promised to improve his attitude.
3: On several occations he would rather play his warlock even though that his priest is his main, and he still needed loot from MC/OL at that time.
4: He is giving advice/orders to ect. my gf (heirmaine), when he cleary doesnt have his own **** under control, and i am sure that hes doing the same to others. And this is dispite that advice has allready been given by Wierd several times, and he does those advices like: Let me tell you how to play you character, because you clearly dont know kinda way imo.
I do not know if the other FMs have more to add but this is what comes to my mind.
Even if none of the RG2 Fms like this person i still think we should be a bit less prejudging as he might think everything was fine when he came to the raid tonight, and then gets a harsh whisper/comment in a channel. I know we have thought about demoting several times, and the irritation has just been building up, but he might not know this and therefore as a FM we should still keep our head cool before we do stuff/whispers or what our actions might be.
Aipril never Listen nor replay what is sad to him in Priest channel if u want to speak to him u have to whisper and not surtain u get an replay anyway.
Alot of times he have pulled agro by overhealing and when i ask him how come or why, he dont replay.
Shows up late for raids (was before christmas break) whines about Loots called ALL priest in RG2 n00b priest just becuse he was late for a raid and didnt get spot therefor missed Eye of Divinty.
His act on raids/Class channel is none Aiprils preformance is always low on every raid RG2 have done (between 0-5%) of the total raid healing this must have something to do with him not listening nor try to act like 1 in the raid.
Kind Requards Wierd
I really dislike this person he is a loot whore, arrogant, hardly attends raids (attendance is crap), bitches and wines all the time. I believe with the attitude he has shown last night both in the raid and forums he shold get a Gkick. I even dragged him into a private channel last night and for the brief time he was in there lets just say the language was colorful.
Quote from: DarkAngel;171245I believe with the attitude he has shown last night both in the raid and forums he shold get a Gkick.
Agree - he seems to have learn anything since his last warning or the one before.
Wasn't Aipril the one who was standing in the wrong position last night at Firemaw (ie in Brood's room as opposed to in Firemaw's room as instructed by DA)? I think he was, so in addition to yelling for 3 or 4 separate innervates (I mean damn it we don't have that many innervates per priest in a raid), he ignored the RL instructions during a boss fight, stood in the wrong place and did his own thing?
I'm just trying to build up a picture here so that we can formulate a nice response that leaves no room for manouvre.
TL.
Aipril was standing in the wrong spot at last night Firemaw fight he was even told to come up to our (were the other priest stand) spot in whisper but didnt replay that was the reson why i asked in TS if he was inside the room or outside.All the other priest/wierd/heirmaine/grimad was standing with the other druids so we could recive a innervate if needed,The spot we have been asinged to be at for this fight (Firemaw)
Quote from: TeaLeaf;171265Wasn't Aipril the one who was standing in the wrong position last night at Firemaw (ie in Brood's room as opposed to in Firemaw's room as instructed by DA)? I think he was, so in addition to yelling for 3 or 4 separate innervates (I mean damn it we don't have that many innervates per priest in a raid), he ignored the RL instructions during a boss fight, stood in the wrong place and did his own thing?
I'm just trying to build up a picture here so that we can formulate a nice response that leaves no room for manouvre.
TL.
Jep - that's the guy.
Imo i think Gkick would be overrated.
1. have you been talking with him in personal and given him a warning?
If not then we might do that 1st.
2. I have been doing alot of pvp with him and hes been i couple 20-mans where i dident had any problems with him.
i think that gkick is the fastest and most harsh desicion to take. I know how frustrating it can be when ppl dont listen. But lets cool down take some private chats with the different ppl we thing that needs a "warning" and see what happens there. If they still act like morons then you have done your job and warned him/her and then do the gkick.
Aswell as TBC is here soonish and thats the time we can dicide weather ppl should in or out. Dont think that RG2 can afford to loose ppl atm.
all in short: Talk with him, explain him how its done, and hear what he has to say. Give him the warning and then let him decide weather he wants to be a teamplayer or a solorunner.
btw. demote can handle it instead of gkick ;)
Yrthal.
He has been giving 2 warnings! before last night. This has been going on for some time now, Yrthal.
Indeed he is okay in 5 man and pvp, but in raids where ppl depend on him listening and doing as told hes just too selfish to do the job.
He has been given several warnings, and as i see it aint getting any better. For the future i will not be in any raidgroup that he is in (when tbc comes)
Imo we do not have the right to gkick him because he doesnt work in a raidgroup, as there are other aspects in SoG than raiding... A demote would do just fine...
We have had discussion with Aipril before and it didnt work out since he cant live up to what he promise,and he act like a child sometimes in raids-
well this is history soon when TBC comes out but i will never been in the same group nor the same raid as Aipril.
So
We have had discussion with Aipril before and it didnt work out since he cant live up to what he promise,and he act like a child sometimes in raids-
well this is history soon when TBC comes out but i will never been in the same group nor the same raid as Aipril.
We have had discussion with Aipril before and it didnt work out since he cant live up to what he promise,and he act like a child sometimes in raids-
well this is history soon when TBC comes out but i will never been in the same group nor the same raid as Aipril.
At times it helps better for a senior member (at least in his eye's) to talk to him about his behaviour, like me or TL. Kicking at this point is something i would really like to avoid. However, a temp exclusion from raids might work.
Anyways a temp. exclusion from raids wont help much imo since TBC is in 11 days not much we can do really...
Facts: he has 2 warnings from ealier stunts, and with a 3. warning he should be demoted imo...
Now read all the posts.
Imo, he dosent fit SoG profile for members, he's just a big egoist. Incabable of recieving orders and acting upon. If you cannot do this then SoG and raids isent the place for you. (Do any of you remember Richardi?? - This was exeactly the same problem, and when he was made aware of the problem, in a 110% nice way, he acted like a 110% arsehole!)
I do not want this dude in any raid any more, I hate playing with him because I know what kinda of 'damage' he does to the other priests, and what kinda negative attitude he tries to rub off on Wierd and other FM's.
So buttom line, I support Gkick, I support demotion. Lets wait for his reply to an official PM from either TL or Bastet.
Last word, If I ever join anything where he's a part off, consider my spot in that raid ect. open.
(EDIT) After reading the post aipril made again, and bunched up with his brother on to make a bad atmosphere in the guild, I just feel like pukeing(sp). It must run in the family to be an idiot, cuz shadowscream also acted like this before.
Shadowscream is a very friendly player and i like to play with him alot usually - if someone attacted my family(my gf ex.) it would **** me off to, and i would defend her. I think he should be demoted and leave it there...
Still Siff, this isent the only time Shadowscream acted like this. He has been acting very immature in various other subjects, among others the loot issue a while back.
But he plays good, and corrects after Nefrion, so other that this, I have no urgent issues with him.
Well i have come to a dicision now and its becuse of this issue.
I think alot off ppl will be dissapointed at me and such but i think i will stepp down to a soldier leave the Marshall duty also gone cut down on raiding untill TBC is out.ofc if RG2 need me in some way just grab me ingame guys.
I also want to make my druid my main character in TBC since im feed up with playing my priest atm.
What goes for the class leading im not the right person to do that job since it cause only issues when i do correct someone.
Ill thank all the Field Marshalls for their support and help on this issue but this finally did it for me im not gone take **** becuse 1 person cant take a small correction and cause of theat flame me all over the forums.
Thank you guys for a fun time in the FM room :byebye:
As per TS discussion, i dont accept and propose a solution which demotes aipril
Draft PM to aipril
QuoteSince you shown over the last month and a half to not want to listen to your RG2 class and raid leaders, neither in whisper, raid, ts or class channel. Most of the stuff that happens, tactics and otherwise, has a good reason for beeing there.
Some of the things the Field Marshal's noticed are:
Not following tactics,
Not replying or following instructions,
Severe overhealing leading to overagro of MT.
Complaining about other members of the group getting loot, when your not even in the group.
Also swearing to a member, by a Field Marshal or not, is unacceptable. At this point i do not have proof that Wierd swore at you, but if you have some proof, then offcourse you have my, and the other Field Marshal's, appologies.
I would have loved to have a chat to you about it, but you have been offline and unreachable since the raid this all took place.
All this combined leads to only once conclusion from my perspective, namely you are unable to live up to the teamwork and teamspirit asked by SOG, and should therefor not be included in the raid group. This PM therefor also is a notification of your demotion to Soldier.
You can add to that, his attendance isent impressive, actually below the required 66% (48%). That is another valid reason to demote him. Noone can argue vs. bad attendance.
Lifetime (10/09/06 - 01/04/07): 48% of raids
http://dkp.silveroakguardians.org/attendance/rg2/viewmember.php?s=&name=Aipril
How about this edit:
QuoteAipril
There was an incident in BWL last week between you and another Field Marshall that affected the whole raid group and so I have tried to investigate what went on, particularly as you have posted about it in the member forums. I would have loved to have a chat to you about it, but you have been offline and unreachable since the raid this all took place. The accusations you posted were essentially that the FM swore at you and was treating you as a third-rate citizen and that this was unacceptable. I therefore spoke to Wierd and asked for his account of the incident. I then spoke with others present and discussed with other FMs their understanding and experience of the raid.
Wierd denies he swore at you. He accepts using the word 'hell' but this is not a swear word. At this point I do not have proof that Wierd swore at you, but if you have some proof, then of course you have my and the other Field Marshal's, sincere apologies. I have taken the opportunity to remind all FMs that this type of behaviour is not acceptable.
However my wider discussions with the other FMs also uncovered some more concerning aspects of your participation in the raid. Some of the things the Field Marshal's noticed were:
- You rarely answer whispers in raid, whether from your class leader or raid leader.
- You rarely answer TS requests.
- You do not always follow the tactics laid down by the Raid Leader (most of the stuff that happens, tactics and otherwise, has a good reason for being there). Your position and the macro request at the Firemaw fight are good examples of this.
- Your attendance is currently below the expected level for your raid rank.
- Severe overhealing leading to overagro of MT and/or rapid loss of mana causing an innervate (or several) to be wasted.
- Complaining about other members of the group getting loot, when your not even in the group.
All this combined leads to only one conclusion from my perspective, namely you are unable to live up to the teamwork and teamspirit asked by SOG, and should therefore not be included in the raid group. This PM therefore also is a notification of your demotion to Soldier.
Thanks TL, ill PM it if he dont pop up to talk to me soon. (as in, tonight)
Managed to talk to him, explain a few things, and conversation ended in him requesting demotion. problem solved in a nice way.