I am disappointed and a little confused.
28 people signed up for ICC10.
A 10-person group was formed and went in. Cool.
Six people formed a second group for a fresh run and no one else wanted to go with us...not even on alts.
Was that because the 1st group were all elite players and those who remained didn't want to go with such an inexperienced group (well, I can only speak for me)? Are people only focussed on the second and subsequent wings?
Would it have been easier to get two groups if we had evened out the elite and less experienced players between two groups?
Please ease my confusion and let me know why we couldn't get a second 10-person group together from those who signed up.
Robert
aka Treekin, sorry-ass noob
I wasn't there but I wouldn't have gone into the second group on my main as I would have wanted to be able to join the progression group later in the raid week to push the new content. I guess there are a number of people in the same boat. I would have been happy to do it on my alt though so not sure why people didn't do that.
I didn't join on my main or any of my alts tonight as i had already decided that if only one grp was made then i would finish my Paladin off with Ezflow. Which i have now done:D
I played guess who and beat my 10 yr old easily...
Personally 3 nights raiding 25 man and poss 1 badge run on 10 man for druid and DK is enough.. but if im on im happy to mix with anyone for quick 10 man
Quote from: Bellanie;309531I didn't join on my main or any of my alts tonight as i had already decided that if only one grp was made then i would finish my Paladin off with Ezflow. Which i have now done:D
2 groups were made... but no one wanted to finish forming the second group.
I'll tell you why I didn't join the second group. I wanted to be in the pioneering group that was putting in the effort and trying to down the lich king. I'd tried to be there when I could this and last week for raids. Oh well clearly means nothing that one anyway...enough of me.
What we need to do is form groups from those that are signed up so that more than a small group can get through ICC10.
Besides I think that everyone should be pushing to get through ICC10 now so they can learn the fights for 25man.
Something something something moan whine sleep! :taz:
Like Rob said, there were a lot of people online from which I formed one 10man group.
I took 3 "newbies" in this group to get them through Blood Wing, to give them a taste of this in preparation of 25man progress there.
This was probably the best balance between getting through the earlier bosses quickly, to get onto progression bosses, without gimping the group.
There were many senior players left who weren't in my group who could have helped get a second group going. Obviously, Im only human and can't run two groups at once.
I was a bit late logging on last night, so that is one signup not there. I would of course love to be able to raid some, but I'm still a bit unsure if my current gear is sufficiant. Been reading up some on tactics, but I really prefer learning by doing myself.
Id like to chime in abit here on 10 mans.
As a pertty "old" raider who has raided from MC to BT/Hyjal and some in SP. They way the 10 mans was sorted before was that raid leaders would splitt into 2 groups and lead the raid. One group would most of the time go further or faster. This was for the raid group to gear up and get the gear they needed from the 10 man. For Karazhan we ran 10 mans 2-3 times a week, with a 4 and 5 day 25 man raiding group. We had a group of about 30+ raiders and some ofc had to sit out. But we rotated on it, letting the less geard ppl in on the easier fights. And then where a class was needed we had them in. This way the group got pretty fast geard up.
It's pointless to have a 10 man group where all has the gear needed from the first let's say 5 bosses. When you got ppl who need the gear from there.
Yesterday i got an invite for ICC 10 man, and i got a response not with that gear. As my GS was 4k at that time, gone up alittle now ;) I know gear means alot, but you need to start somewhere. We dragged trough ppl in Karazhan with only blues before i remember.
I think ppl think that gearscore ways too much, it should not. I was in a HC last night and got in a group with ppl that had 5k+ GS and i was top DPS with 4k GS. It's alot about how you play your charactar and if you are good at it.
So let the lower geard ppl in to the 10 mans. Maybe do a lower lvl 10 man then ICC, but i guess ppl just want to do ICC. Ok you might not get as far the first weeks, but as ppl gear up ul get further and further.
As a "newb" in the guild, and for not been here too long i hope ppl don't get offended for my oppinions. But i hope the officers and raid leaders think about running the runs for ppl that do not have as good gear either. And perhaps for ppl that don't want to get locked in another 10 man just cause they might get into the lich king kill group later. What will you do if you don't get in. Maybe help out and get another group up to that lvl of gear. Where they are able to kill the lich king perhaps in 10 man?
It will def help out the 25 man group as well. As they will have more ppl to choose from. And would not need help from another guild to progress.
This got abit longer then i expected but hey ;)
Just my 2 cents
Quote from: jantore;309578I know gear means alot, but you need to start somewhere. We dragged trough ppl in Karazhan with only blues before i remember.
I take your point here Jan, but then Karazhan was the entry level raid, but ICC is essentially the end game raid at the moment.
There is no longer a natural a learning/gearing up curve similar to TBC - Enter at Karazhan, move onto ZA, BT, TK and SWP etc.
If I can put the new system into TBC terms - we now have players expecting to raid Sunwell having skipped EVERYTHING (Kara etc) before Sunwell's release.
ICC shouldn't be considered a traditional boost, in my opinion, people should have a significant amount of gear from ToC and the Icc 5mans before considering raiding Icc.
The gear you get from heroic farming, ToC 10/25, and the new heroics at Icc is ridiculously good.
I really am struggling to see the cause for this thred. I may be being thick but ICC on an OFF night is nothing to do with the officers running them, they are ran in guild but you are not tied to them and there is no real officer input on them.
JT, I am sorry if you disagree but there are some steps in gearing up and you simply cant expect anybody will eagerly literally drag you through ICC 10 when most of your gear would be upgraded in Naxxramas.
You cant even remotely compare it to "drag" people in blues through Karazhan because that means they were "skipping" only half a tier. That would be rather like dragging you through Naxxramas.
To be clear, I am not one of those GS d**kheads, I dont even have that addon. Also, you will never hear from me anything about low geared (as opposed to wrong geared) people in heroics - heroics are there to gear people up.
But I would NEVER write on guild forum that I have been denied to be dragged through content three tiers higher than I should be doing. Seriously JT, why shoudnt you do it like anyone else has been doing it - grind heroics, get 232 gear from them and buy 245 gear and tier gear for emblems. If you were denied in THAT gear, then you should ask "Why?". But not now.
Sorry that I abstracted from skills in my post - I am aware that they are great factor in performance - but you are not going to beat Deathwhisper berserk timer in blue ilvl200 gear.
Quote from: DFE;309598JT, I am sorry if you disagree but there are some steps in gearing up and you simply cant expect anybody will eagerly literally drag you through ICC 10 when most of your gear would be upgraded in Naxxramas.
You cant even remotely compare it to "drag" people in blues through Karazhan because that means they were "skipping" only half a tier. That would be rather like dragging you through Naxxramas.
To be clear, I am not one of those GS d**kheads, I dont even have that addon. Also, you will never hear from me anything about low geared (as opposed to wrong geared) people in heroics - heroics are there to gear people up.
But I would NEVER write on guild forum that I have been denied to be dragged through content three tiers higher than I should be doing. Seriously JT, why shoudnt you do it like anyone else has been doing it - grind heroics, get 232 gear from them and buy 245 gear and tier gear for emblems. If you were denied in THAT gear, then you should ask "Why?". But not now.
Sorry that I abstracted from skills in my post - I am aware that they are great factor in performance - but you are not going to beat Deathwhisper berserk timer in blue ilvl200 gear.
I don't disagree, it's more of a ppl wanted a guild run. Yes it might be tough and will make ppl learn. But i do understand the issue about gear. Now the thing is to get into those instances where you can get the gear. And as i can't see the guild running Naxx 10/25 runs as ppl don't want them what is a bloke supposed to do. PUG 25 man eh well.
Maybe we should put together a 10/25 man run in a instances lower then ICC for ppl wanting to gear up there alts and for my main as ive been "afk" since Lich king came out ;)
I have no plans on going for the 25 man raid group, id just want to get in on the 10 man and maybe go for a guild 25 man run outside of the ICC runs.
But i see it now, il just hafto grind grind and grind some more ;)
JT
JT - Naxx can be skipped entirely, you can get everything you need from heroics and Trial of the Crusader 10/25man.
I run these each week, specifically to gear up certain players/toons, even the original poster won Misery's End (link here: http://www.wowhead.com/item=47193) this week :D
I would also stress the need for people to be fully prepared in terms of gearing, for example, if I know you're not hit capped, which the Original Poster isn't, that simply has to influence invitations.
Correction - with Balance of Power and IFF OP is hit capped :doh:
Remember We are all Pixies!:roflmao:
Quote from: Leemo;309606JT - Naxx can be skipped entirely, you can get everything you need from heroics and Trial of the Crusader 10/25man.
I didnt mean it like JT should go to Naxx, then to Ulduar, ToCr and then finaly to ICC, that would be stupid. I meant it like this: You cant expect to be invited to ICC when most of your gear is of quality that is worse than Naxxramas gear.
And yeah, it really takes some grind to gear up for latest tier, although not as much as in your raiding days, JT ;)
And those ToCr alt runs are also good and quick way to get prepared.
well at least we got to saurfang rob so was'nt a complete waste of a night
I'd like to let you guys in on my thoughts on this subject. I don't see the reason for this thread. I was not on last night, so I can't say what happened then, but I clearly remember me taking both Treekin and Jantore on the ICC10 runs I organised the past weeks. The past 2 weeks I did not continue on the Lich King on my main, so that others got a chance to see him. I did however setup altruns on all 3 my 80s! Specifically to give ppl a chance to gear up, and maybe even see some bosses. I did not ask for Gearscore. I did not even ask for ppl to know tactics or have achievements. I just organised these to have fun.
I haven't been an officer in this guild for long, and I'm trying to adapt to the way things are handled here, but I can say that this is a friendly guild, with a very helpfull attitude. I doubt you'll find much better in any guild. The way lower geared ppl are being rotated into even the ICC25 mans is a good example of that. Can we plz stop all the complaining and enjoy the game? And just to give an indication: I was running the Heroics with friends on my mage when they were still considered to be hard. Then I ran Naxx in PUGs, where I met some very good friends btw. After that I changed guilds and ran Ulduar, then ToC. In the meantime the same process followed on both my alts, luckily boosted quite a bit by the new emblem system and the daily Heroics. Now I have 3 80s, that are all up for ICC. It's a lot of work to get there.
Bottomline: I'm always willing to help out, more then willing to gear up ppl, but I'm getting quite tired of all the complaints on this forum. Bottomline: ICC is an endgame raid, which would not be fun if it would be easy. So I'd say be happy if you get in there, but don't expect it as something you're automatically entitled to. Just as we all have, you have to earn it, by showing up, gearing up and a looooooot of reading up.
I'm not judging anyone. I don't really know most of you well enough yet. And I'll keep organising altruns which I will try getting together weekly (MOAR HEALERS PLZ!!!!!). If you have any complaint, plz feel free to contact me in game and I'll be happy to sort things out, as some of you hopefully already experienced. But stop putting up complaints in threads like this. We have a load of officers. There must be one you feel comfortable talking to. And most of all: ENJOY PLAYING! It's what the game is made for. :)