http://www.icy-veins.com/madness-of-deathwing-detailed-strategy
TLDR version:
1-2 tanks
3 healers
5-6 dps
P1: Strategy
-attack limb on platform (no aggro table)
-Tanks pick up Mutated Corruption (face away from raid) and DPS burn it down (before Crushing is cast)
-when add is killed MT is Impale debuffed, use CDs (PS/HoS etc) to survive, maybe even Dream Spell, may need an OT taunt if the Impale is itself debuffed
-Elementium Bolt cast, dps prio on it, stay max range from impact zone (yellow swirling graphic) if it is not going to die before it lands (damage increases with proximity)
-use raidwall is bolt is going to hit, or Ysera's Dream
-continue on Mutated Corruption tentacle until dead
-then back to limb
-Renegerative Bloods, tank in Time Zone (if Nozdormu up), single target them down using MA as they heal to full health every 10 secs (you can AOE them but only if they die within 10 secs)
-@limb 75%, 50% and 25% Blistering Tentacles spawn, use MA and focus DPS down (or Alexstraza will kill them)
-Cataclysm is cast as you finish limb and this means you have 60 seconds to finish the job and depart to next platform
-when a platform is 'saved' you lose that NPC's buff
-move to next platform, rinse & repeat, enter P2 when all 4 platforms saved
P2: Strategy
-all NPC buffs return
-follow to correct platform
-elementium fragments, no aggro, highest dps prio
-use Dream to survive Shrapnell
-tanks pick up Elementium Terrors fast, focus MA dps on them, tanks need CDs here
-liberal use of all raidwalls as required
-in general burn adds prio, then boss
NPC Buffs
Alexstrasza - +20% HP and destroys all Burning Tentacles in P1, lowers damage from Corrupted Blood in P2, probably 4th target
Kalecgos - +20% DPS buff, +splash damage on each attack, probably 3rd target
Nozdormu - +20% haste & Time Zone (slows bolt, -50% attack speed) - probably 2nd target
Ysera - +20% healing, Dream Spell & tentacle killer - generally weakest buff so probably first target
Last Normal mode boss left for this content patch, so let's make it a goodun on Tuesday! Prep up folks!
(http://www.icy-veins.com/images/dragon-soul-madness-of-deathwing-overview-deathwing.jpg)
Likely order is Ysera > Nozdormu > Kalecgos > Alexstrasza
Another possible is Ysera > Alexstrasza > Nozdormu > Kalecgos
Which strat we use depends on the effectiveness of the splash damage from Kalecgos buff. If it works well then we won't need Alexstraza's add-killing buff and can AOE the Regenerative Bloods with the benefit fo the buff. It's a little wierd though as some talk of AOE and others (inc Icy Veins) say:
QuoteAdditionally, your raid will now have to manually kill the Blistering Tentacles each time they spawn. As these adds are immune to AoE, you will have to use single target attacks against them.
Ysera defintely seems best first.
Nozdormu seems sensible before Kalecgos.
Depends where we fit in Alexstrasza.
General DPS prios on each platform:+00 sec - pull
+10 sec - big tenacle spawns at rear, burn it
+45 sec - elementium bolt, burn it, has to die (preferrably before it lands, certainly within 5.2 seconds of it landing)
+90 sec - regenerative bloods, dps down (either AOE or single target depending on strat)
+120 sec - Cataclysm starts casting
+180 sec - the world ends if boss arm/wing is not dead by now
move to next platform, rinse & repeat
Tank & Healer Prios-watch tank CDs for Impale
-care on positioning (frontal cone)
-raidwalls for Elementium Blast if bolt is not destroyed and lands
-watch healing required on stacks from bloods
One final note. This fight will probably end up being a 15 minute encounter (11 mins or so in P1, 3-4 mins in P2), so let's use your CDs accordingly and work out the maximum number we can get into the fight.
Shadow Priest
2 x (healing) Divine Hymn (8 min CD - first one must be early, within first approx 6 mins, i.e. on first two platforms)
3 x (mana) Hymn of Hope (6 min CD - first one must be within first 3 mins, i.e. on first platform)
Dispersion one bolt landing per platform to reduce healing requirement (2 min CD)
Disc Priest:
Power Word: Barrier(3 min CD) -25% damage for 10 secs, +10% healing
2 x (healing) Divine Hymn (8 min CD - first one must be early, within first approx 6 mins, i.e. on first two platforms)
3 x (mana) Hymn of Hope (6 min CD - first one must be within first 3 mins, i.e. on first platform)
Warrior
Rallying Cry (3 min CD) +20% HP for 10 seconds
Druid
Tranquility (non-resto 8 min CD)
Tranquility (resto 3 min CD)
Resto Shaman
Spirit Link Totem (3 min CD) -10% damage for 6 secs, 10yd range, HP redistribution
Holy Paladin
Aura Mastery (2 min CD) - +100% to Devotion/Resistance & Ret Auras
Prot Pala
Divine Guardian (3 min CD) -20% damage for 6 secs, range 30 yds
Unholy Deathknight
Anti-Magic Zone (2 min CD) -75% spell damage for 10 sec
How about your class?
Rallying Cry every 3 minutes. Can be useful for 2nd and 4th Bolt, if it lands.. if you'd use Dream on 1st.
Grimnar:
8 min cd on tranq
for myself
3 min cd on survival instincts
1 min cd on barkskin
desperate action
Bear form and using its healing ability. (at the moment i don't know if i need the 15 seconds aswell or if that is only for raid healing (or am i mixing up patches) will check this and update it when i get home.
I've edited in the other class raidwalls of which I am aware, let me know if I missed one.
Elementium Blast is a fire damage spell, so we should plan to cover each blast & the first tick with a CD. First tick is 5.2 secs after impact, so a 6 sec ability should be able to cover the initial blast plus a tick if timed well. If we run a holy pala on this fight then AM might be ideal (assuming resistance aura is up and reduction in damage is sufficiently high - we might need to double it up with other CDs) as it would keep all other CDs available for P2 or other emergencies. First platform should be golden anyway with the availability of Dream, so platforms 2, 3 & 4 are the main concern.
Platform 1
+00 sec - pull
+10 sec - big tenacle spawns at rear, burn it
+45 sec - DREAM SPELL - 50% damage reduction for 5 seconds
+45 sec - elementium bolt, burn it, has to die (preferrably before it lands, certainly within 5.2 seconds of it landing)
+50 sec - elemtium tick (might need a CD here if not dead)
+90 sec - regenerative bloods, dps down (either AOE or single target depending on strat)
+120 sec - Cataclysm starts casting
+180 sec - the world ends if boss arm/wing is not dead by now
Platform 2
+00 sec
+10 sec - big tenacle spawns at rear, burn it
+45 sec - RAID WALL
+45 sec - elementium bolt, burn it, has to die (preferrably before it lands, certainly within 5.2 seconds of it landing)
+50 sec - elemtium tick (might need a CD here if not dead)
+90 sec - regenerative bloods, dps down (either AOE or single target depending on strat)
+120 sec - Cataclysm starts casting
+180 sec - the world ends if boss arm/wing is not dead by now
Platform 3
+00 sec
+10 sec - big tenacle spawns at rear, burn it
+45 sec - RAID WALL
+45 sec - elementium bolt, burn it, has to die (preferrably before it lands, certainly within 5.2 seconds of it landing)
+50 sec - elemtium tick (might need a CD here if not dead)
+90 sec - regenerative bloods, dps down (either AOE or single target depending on strat)
+120 sec - Cataclysm starts casting
+180 sec - the world ends if boss arm/wing is not dead by now
Platform 4
+00 sec
+10 sec - big tenacle spawns at rear, burn it
+45 sec - RAID WALL
+45 sec - elementium bolt, burn it, has to die (preferrably before it lands, certainly within 5.2 seconds of it landing)
+50 sec - elemtium tick (DEFINITE RAID WALL as no slowing)
+90 sec - regenerative bloods, PROBABLE TANK CD IF NOZDORMU DOWN, dps down (either AOE or single target depending on strat)
+120 sec - Cataclysm starts casting
+180 sec - the world ends if boss arm/wing is not dead by now
Note:
45 sec timing is for cast of bolt, CDs are needed on LANDING not on cast
Need too inter-weave Impale CDs for tanks.
Need to have as many raidwalls as possible available in P2
Good solid Platform 4 performance tonight and consistently over 9 minutes into the fight (we're ahead on dps by some way).
We wiped when we got sloppy
-slow dps pick up on bolt/blazing/bloods
-missed a CD
Need to work out how to get out of the Elementium Bolt on platform 4. We currently using
-spirit link (think it is active too early, needs a delay as it is almost expired at the point we take the damage)
-DG
-we're losing people to crush right after
Think we need to add one here to get us higher HP as we exit and do
-DG
-later spirit link combined with a tranquility or hymn
That should push us comfortably into P2 and the kill. Looking forward to next week!
I know that a few times I was a bit slow on the uptake of DPS'ing the Bolts, I also picked up my DPS considerably in the last 3 or so attempts from about 30k to 40k+ at some points. Also Puja had to shout at me for sticking on the Deathwing Tentacle rather than switching to the one at the back of the platform so that's something I can improve on.
Quote from: TeaLeaf;339516Need to work out how to get out of the Elementium Bolt on platform 4. We currently using
-spirit link (think it is active too early, needs a delay as it is almost expired at the point we take the damage)
-DG
-we're losing people to crush right after
Think we need to add one here to get us higher HP as we exit and do
-DG
-later spirit link combined with a tranquility or hymn
When that bolt is hitting, we need to use Tranq in addition to the Spirit Link Totem we have. There is so much damage incoming in such short duration of time, and the Spirit Link Totem is a short range healing "equalifier", meaning it doesnt do more healing, it just "levels out all health bars within 10yards" (feel free to read my
new post (http://www.deadmen.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?34638-Spirit-Link-Totem.&p=339538#post339538) in the healing section). The mechanics here makes it useful in some cases(with tranq)... less useful in others(with DG). And grouped up with Healing Rain + Tranq + Wild Growth... it is amazing.
When Bolt hits - I learned that spamming Whytee with Healing Surges is the only way to go to keep him up. So my Healing Rain might not be on the ground for a short duration of time. A Hpalas AoE healing is also weak compared to i.e. a druids Wild Growth in this little, but very hard potion of the fight.
But it does reduces damage taken aswell ;)
Quote from: Arcticfire;339542But it does reduces damage taken aswell ;)
With 10%. For 6 seconds. If within 10 yards. This was a tricky bit yesterday. Getting ppl in the area before it expired.
Edit:
Would it be an idea... to take Nozdormus platform last?
NPC buffs:Nozdormu - +20% haste & Time Zone (slows bolt, -50% attack speed)
This means we wont have to eat any bolts at all?
Here is a guild that is having the same problems we went through yesterday.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1037558-Madness-of-Deathwing-issues-%2810man%29
The thread Slush posted has some interresting points around the single tank strategy. Due to the additional DPS, you shouldn't get a second Impale and that's what makes it possible. Also the bubble isn't there to reset the stacks, it's to absorb the actual impale (Wait until cast starts->bubble->get hit->cancel bubble ASAP->taunt). If we can get it down before the second impale then the bubble wouldn't be required on platforms 1-3.
Where the bubble would be useful is on the last platform, everyone stack under the claw other than the tank and they bubble through the bolt and the second impale, which will hit as dps are out of range/moving due to stacking under claw.
I reckon these are some good suggestions to try (not all together, but separate) based on that thread
- Drop a tank, add a DPS, thereby killing Corruptions before 2 impales and soaking the Impale using bubble/BoP
- Change platform order, allowing for the killing of the bolt on the last platform (losing Kalecgos, how big of an impact will this have on killing Regenerative Bloods?)
- Popping hero on last Corruption in order to kill it before the bolt comes in, removing the problem of Impale right after Bolt landing (same result as first option but only on the last platform, keeping 2 tanks). Question here is if our dps is high enough to kill tentacle before the bolt lands with 5 dps even with hero
Quote from: Azunai;339550I reckon these are some good suggestions to try (not all together, but separate) based on that thread
- Drop a tank, add a DPS, thereby killing Corruptions before 2 impales and soaking the Impale using bubble/BoP
- Change platform order, allowing for the killing of the bolt on the last platform (losing Kalecgos, how big of an impact will this have on killing Regenerative Bloods?)
I don't see how those two will work together as we won't be able to get the big tentacle add down before the second Impale without the dps boost.
They won't. That is why I said "not all together, but separate" ;-)
Uncertain on whether to change tactic on this or not.
I see the logic in one more dps and going on tank, but it also creates problems in other areas, like Tetanus, bloods (or impale) etc if the tentacle is still up.
But dps is right on track for a kill at 385k rdps when compared to other guilds who also 2 tanked/3 healed the encounter, so the current strat is sound, it just needs to get through that final Elementium Blast and the transition which probably means a slightly changed raidwall combo. Current strat & current DPS levels should give us a kill at about 13.5 mins, so we're literally 2 mins from the kill with one nasty transition to get through plus the burn phase into the soft enrage.
I think on relfection I'd like to try our current strat one more time.
If that fails, we could try moving to Ysera > Alexstraza > Kalecgos > Nozdormu and then see if the dps holds up on platform 4 and in P2.
If not, we can then drop to either 1 tank or 2 heals (2 heals only if Nozdormu is last).
2 healers might hurt sub 5% in P2 due to the high damage inbound on the raid at that point (50k per tick).
Think that's how I see it panning out atm.
Quote from: TeaLeaf;339617Uncertain on whether to change tactic on this or not.
I was thinking the same after I posted and read the other posts. We worked through the platforms, and at the end we managed to keep tanks + ourselves up through that bolt.
Our progress is good, but I think we all hoped/expected to be 8/8 after the great thurs+sun raids. Keeping calm and focus on current tactic might be the key here.
Seeing the only thing we really failed on ( forgetting the personal mistakes of people including me :P ) is the last the bolt bit on platform 4 and up.
If you say the dps is ok even without the buff we could try a different way but seeing we wipes on like 1% on burn phase on platform 4 im not really sure we got the dps for it without the buff.
I havent looked at logs for that part so its just a guess.
anyway, i hope we get 2 full evenings on madness so we can get it down this week :)
A valid point Hubbah. One of the things that will help dps is the better timing of heroism when we get onto Platform 4. We used it late and as an after-thought last time, whereas we can time it better to be used at the beginning of the platform on the wing/arm & tentacle prior to the bolt arriving. I believe this will make a significant difference to the dps on that platform and keep us ahead of the curve. I'd say about 10 second into Platform 4 (tentacle spawns) might be the sweet spot as it will also allow some buffed DPS on the bolt which will then reduce the tick damage from it after it has landed.
Yeah ok, fair enough. Remember we're going to get a lot of new kit as well, which in the end will only make it easier. If we can get this far on first week already, our current tactic is only going to be easier as the weeks go by.
Been looking into this a bit this morning and it seems to me that we're light on DPS atm and might need to move to a 1 tank, 3 healer strat to bring our rdps up to the required levels. Most recorded kills are in the 400k rdps range (median & average) whereas we're at about 370k rdps.
That means the end portion of the fight sees far higher dps and we can clear platform 4 without using a heroism (which we failed to get to try last night due to the bolt wipe!). Tanks are doing circa 22-24k dps here, so we'd lose 22-24k dps and gain a 42-44k dps (a net gain of circa 20k dps). That would bring our rdps to about 390k rdps which is nicely within the range of dps recorded for kills. Our current rdps at 370k rdps is at the very bottom end of what is possible to get a kill, so we either change group composition or improve what we do individually to get better overall returns.
The order we're using (Ysera > Alexstrasza > Nozdormu > Kalecgos) is generally considered to be good.
Alternatively, other changes might improve our position:
-prio blistering over bloods
-assigning specific sides to ranged, mid to melee etc for blistering
Quote from: TeaLeaf;339910-assigning specific sides to ranged, mid to melee etc for blistering
As for this, I was already doing a set few of them every time.
At the 3rd platform doing the mid one, then the furthest left, then the one 'in his armpit' that everyone seems to always forget ;-)
At the 4th platform doing the furthest, then working my way in, as they spawn neatly in a row.
Hmm, interesting!
Quotehunters can deterrence to completely avoid damage from the bolt
Seems in general that a lot of people in P2 aim to kill one set tentacles, one set terrors, one set tentacles, off-tank terrors & kill boss.
I think we do need to offtank and burn .... It feels like a race from the healing side with our heals only slowing the decay of heath never getting ontop of it. By the 2nd set of Terrors we are in the ball park where the damage coming in seems to be about the same as the healing going out (raid) and we still need to keep the tanks up
For some reason im thinking its a beter idea to kill the first wave of tentacles then the first 2 big adds, dps boss down to 10.5% then 2nd wave of tentacles and the 2 adds.
With doing this we are freeing up the tanks ( and healers ) to do some dps as well + they would be in the aoe healing and the single target healing would be alot eazier ( i think.. cant really prove this :P )
A 2nd thing that i noticed in last nights attempts is that the we need abit more dmg to get everything going smoother ( is that how you write it? )
We came close to wiping on Cataclysm on last platform a few times and this is with TL & Jes multi dotting the boss while rest is on tentacle. Without the multidotting we woud probably not even make it.
And last a question from my part, if you both dident multi dot would that help us get the tentacle down before bolt spawns? and if so would it cost you alot of dps ( more then we can make up for ? ) on the boss?
Anyway, i had fun last night and hope we can get this one down next reset so we can start wiping on HC's ( damn they look crazy ).
Quote from: hubbah;340081And last a question from my part, if you both dident multi dot would that help us get the tentacle down before bolt spawns? and if so would it cost you alot of dps ( more then we can make up for ? ) on the boss?
Maybe, and perhaps I should try it, but I suspect not as the amount of HP left is usually more than a few seconds worth.
For my part, I'm stealing about 1.3 seconds every 15 seconds to refresh VT and about 2 seconds to Mind Flay to refresh SW:P. So I could add circa 3.5 seconds (I retarget whilst flaying so minimal time is lost) to the Tentacle which is 2 ticks of Mindflay maximum every 13 seconds. Keep in mind that during that period I refresh DOTs on the claw/wing I already have all of my DOTs up on Tentacle, hence why the only lost DPS is the Mind Flay ticks. All my primary nukes (buffed MB or SW:D) also go to the Tentacle on CD.
If the Tentacle is up for say 90 seconds, then lost Tentacle DPS due to multi-dot is circa:
(AveFlayTick)*90/2 = 12,000*90/2 = 540,000 HP (if Tentacle is up for less then damage lost is less)
Assuming Wing/Claw during the 90 seconds the Tentacle is up then DPS gain on the Claw/Wing due to Multi DOT is circa:
VT - 15 sec, 12k tick; SWP - 20 sec, 6.6k tick; MindFlay 2 ticks @ 12k to refresh
90/2*[12,000 + 6,600] + 540k (from MindFlay above which would otherwise be on Tentacle) = 1,377,000 HP.
1.377m HP is the equivalent of: 3.5 seconds @ 400k rdps (which probably overstates the rdps as this includes AOE too)
1.377m HP is the equivalent of: 4.6 seconds @ 300k rdps (which is probably a more accurate 'gues's at single target rdps)
On most tries we could afford to lose the 4.6 seconds as we're typically 8-10 seconds ahead of the 'big badda boom'. We sometimes get down to the last couple of seconds though, so a change would mean a wipe for those tries.
The key question is, does anyone know the HP left on the Tentacle at the point the Bolt arrives on platform 4? If it is close to 540k then it would seem best for me to NOT multi-dot.
The times i was watching the tentacles at the time the bolt was about to come in we were at around 20% cause most trys i got to fire off 2 kill shots before switching. I think with dots ticking it would come down to around 15% after bolt is down.
Not sure how mutch healh the tentacles got so not sure if thats around the 540.000 :)
Everyone ready for this!?!?! :) Woehoe only 12 more hours before we will be on 8/8 :D
Just for the record:
We adapted our P2 strat to killing first set of tentacles, single target focus killing the first set of Terrors, then killed second set of tentacles, then killed BOTH of the second wave Terrors (again with single target DPS). In the mean time we had pushed the boss down to circa 11.5% (splash had this down to 10.5% or so by the time the second set of Terrors died). As soon as the second Terrors died we turned & burned on the boss pushing him through 10% and IGNORED all further add spawns - the race then becomes killing the boss before the next set of Terrors arrives. Individual responsibility for Shrapnell Dream use once the third set of Tentacles spawned. We used a rolling set of raidwalls starting from about 8% which carried us through to the kill and we even had a PW:B and a Divine Hymn left over at the end.
Wanted to ask if the hero at the 4th platform was intentional or if we also want that somewhere in P2?
And to ask the tanks if they can tank the two adds on top of eachother in P2. I realise it's risky as paladins as youmight steal aggro off eachother but it means I can use Sweeping Strikes, which makes all my attacks hit 2 targets instead of 1 for 10 seconds. Means I do double damage as long as two of them are up, which can make quite a difference. ;-)
Heroism was intentional as I wanted to ensure we got the tentacle down asap and had hasted bolt dps. As we saw, we did not really need the heroism in P2 as the dps requirement was quite low to beat the 3rd set of Terrors.
Thanks Amber, I just spat my coffee out all over my keyboard laughing! I'm going through the fraps video starting to edit it into a movie and I came across this cracker:
QuoteAmber: Watch out Whytee, you've got Shrapnell
BOOOM!!!! - Shrapnell hits Amber for 80% of his HP
Moral of the story: always check your own debuff list first!
Now *that* was funny, if a little wet, so I'm off to wipe the keyboard down! :blush:
post the vid already TL :P we neeeeeeeeeeed to see it! :D
Quote from: hubbah;340669post the vid already TL :P we neeeeeeeeeeed to see it! :D
I'm doing it at the moment, it takes a while when you start with 18GB of fraps footage!
Rendering is in progress, (90 mins or so left) and then I'll upload it. 17mins 20 sec total and in full HD.
Video is now uploaded to Youtube and linked in the media section.
Note for RGT:
Phase 1:
On Platform 3 & 4, make sure we slow/stop dps on the claw until Tentacles/Bolt is down. If we push the Claw below 70% too early then we trigger the first wave of Blisterings whilst we still have the Tentacle & Bolt up. Resolved to just leave one set of DOTs on the Claw (shadow priest) and that worked fine. If both Jes & TL DOT then we ran into problems by being too quick.
Phase 2:
Our DPS is high enough now to just run one set of adds (like LFR), so we kill the first Fragments, then the first pair of Terrors and then push right past 11.5% and directly on to the kill without waiting for any second wave of adds.
Been checking some logs for last raid and its not that weird that we are are seeing such a big jump.
Mr torgen got logged for 2 fights both in the top 150 ( madness & yorshasj ) and a few others are all 1 / 2 k away from being top 200 and we all went up a few K since last 3 raids.
Excuse me for my outburst at the end of the raid, its been a long day and i just dont understand the wipes wich make me abit frustrated.
Quote from: hubbah;342779Excuse me for my outburst at the end of the raid, its been a long day and i just dont understand the wipes wich make me abit frustrated.
Try to heal it and you will understand the wipes.
Wipe 1: Whytees death (Italic is incoming heals)
[22:31:24.615] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 50963 (R: 14156)
[22:31:25.267] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +645
[22:31:25.267] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +444[22:31:25.605] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:31:25.645] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +233[22:31:25.679] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 42347 (R: 11763)
[22:31:26.057] Puja Earth Shield Whytee +8788[22:31:26.057] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +487[22:31:26.112] Deathwing Corrupted Blood Whytee 7200 (R: 2000)
[22:31:26.641] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 30700 (O: 44045, R: 20763)
[22:31:26.982] Whytee dies
2.3seconds of logs. No direct heals on Whytee. 187k damage.
Wipe 2: Hals death (Italic is incoming heals)
[22:46:16.448] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:46:16.596] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 44092 (R: 12248)
[22:46:16.938] Slush Healing Wave Halbarad +17794
[22:46:16.938] Slush Riptide Halbarad +13783
[22:46:17.204] Puja Earthliving Halbarad +3001
[22:46:17.359] Deathwing Corrupted Blood Halbarad 5040 (R: 2400)
[22:46:17.359] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 43083 (R: 11968)
[22:46:17.470] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 55081 (O: 47694, R: 28548)
[22:46:17.722] Halbarad dies
1.028(!) secs of logs. 204k incoming damage. Only 1 direct heal (which should have been a GHW, not a HW.. my bad). But still.
So I have to ask... This last wipe. Did Hal tank both?
Nevermind my last post.
This is Hals damage taken from Elementium Terror this week:
[22:46:04.489] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[22:46:04.489] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 12284 (R: 5850)
[22:46:04.489] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 38639 (R: 18400)
[22:46:05.453] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 14039 (R: 3900)
[22:46:06.469] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 14039 (R: 3900)
[22:46:06.475] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus (2) from Elementium Terror
[22:46:06.475] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 37067 (R: 17651)
[22:46:07.493] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 30886 (R: 8580)
[22:46:08.452] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 30886 (R: 8580)
[22:46:09.452] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 34748 (R: 4290)
[22:46:10.448] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 34748 (R: 4290)
[22:46:11.455] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 30886 (R: 8580)
[22:46:12.449] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 30887 (R: 8580)
[22:46:12.954] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus (3) from Elementium Terror
[22:46:12.954] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 38342 (R: 18258)
[22:46:13.475] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:46:14.598] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 50963 (R: 14156)
[22:46:15.580] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 50963 (R: 14156)
[22:46:16.448] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:46:16.596] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus (4) from Elementium Terror
[22:46:16.596] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 44092 (R: 12248)
[22:46:17.165] Elementium Terror hits Halbarad Dodge
[22:46:17.359] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus (5) from Elementium Terror
[22:46:17.359] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 43083 (R: 11968)
[22:46:17.470] Elementium Terror's Tetanus fades from Halbarad
[22:46:17.470] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 55081 (O: 47694, R: 28548)
This is Hals damage taken from Elementium Terror last week (kill):
[21:55:37.358] Elementium Terror hits Halbarad Dodge
[21:55:37.442] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[21:55:37.442] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 7370 (R: 5850)
[21:55:37.442] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 25882 (R: 11983)
[21:55:38.420] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 7370 (R: 5850)
[21:55:39.455] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 8424 (R: 3900)
[21:55:40.436] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 8424 (R: 3900)
[21:55:41.482] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 8424 (R: 3900)
[21:55:42.445] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 7370 (R: 5850)
[21:55:43.115] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus (2) from Elementium Terror
[21:55:43.115] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 15077 (A: 4072, R: 23641)
[21:55:43.413] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 20849 (R: 4290)
[21:55:44.425] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 20849 (R: 4290)
[21:55:45.437] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 18532 (R: 8580)
[21:55:46.423] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 27025 (R: 12869)
[21:55:47.426] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 30887 (R: 8580)
[21:55:48.429] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad Absorb (30886)
[21:55:49.421] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 23164 (R: 17159)
[21:55:49.421] Elementium Terror's Tetanus fades from Halbarad
Any thoughts on these numbers? Its seems to me like the numbers Hal was getting on last nights try was... WAY to high to heal through.
And 5 stacks? In pretty much the same amount of time? Was the Elementium Terror staying up for 1 second too long? Was Hal hit from behind (no block)? Was he using any CD's on that kill that he didnt use yesterday? Look at the timers here.. 12:20 last week. 13:01 this week. Are we falling behind on dps?
Quote from: Slush;342789Try to heal it and you will understand the wipes.
Wipe 1: Whytees death (Italic is incoming heals)
[22:31:24.615] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 50963 (R: 14156)
[22:31:25.267] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +645
[22:31:25.267] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +444
[22:31:25.605] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:31:25.645] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +233
[22:31:25.679] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 42347 (R: 11763)
[22:31:26.057] Puja Earth Shield Whytee +8788
[22:31:26.057] Teaell Vampiric Embrace Whytee +487
[22:31:26.112] Deathwing Corrupted Blood Whytee 7200 (R: 2000)
[22:31:26.641] Elementium Terror Tetanus Whytee 30700 (O: 44045, R: 20763)
[22:31:26.982] Whytee dies
2.3seconds of logs. No direct heals on Whytee. 187k damage.
Wipe 2: Hals death (Italic is incoming heals)
[22:46:16.448] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 57333 (R: 7078)
[22:46:16.596] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 44092 (R: 12248)
[22:46:16.938] Slush Healing Wave Halbarad +17794
[22:46:16.938] Slush Riptide Halbarad +13783
[22:46:17.204] Puja Earthliving Halbarad +3001
[22:46:17.359] Deathwing Corrupted Blood Halbarad 5040 (R: 2400)
[22:46:17.359] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 43083 (R: 11968)
[22:46:17.470] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 55081 (O: 47694, R: 28548)
[22:46:17.722] Halbarad dies
1.028(!) secs of logs. 204k incoming damage. Only 1 direct heal (which should have been a GHW, not a HW.. my bad). But still.
So I have to ask... This last wipe. Did Hal tank both?
Well 2.3 seconds of logs would mean that at least 2 greater healing waves ( 1 from the tank healer and the other healer that was bouncing around? ) I dont see a renew, no shield, etc.
For hal's like you said there should be a greater healing wave and the dmg is abit crazy, and if im honest i dont really look at the healing logs so im not sure if this is normal or not.
Anyway, last time i healed a raid was 5 years ago at the start of TBC so dont mind me.
Quote from: Slush;342792Nevermind my last post.
This is Hals damage taken from Elementium Terror this week:
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-usx4vs5p7s0wrckk/log/?s=9106&e=9888
This is Hals damage taken from Elementium Terror last week (kill).. Keep in mind that SKULL is the first terror, you can see when debuff falls of Hal:
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k1dllrm665mlz1vc/log/?s=10180&e=10920
Any thoughts on these numbers?
This week Halbarad:
Actor Amount
Mutated Corruption 1824750 31.6 %
Wing Tentacle 1098886 19.0 %
Elementium Terror 753993 13.1 % Arm Tentacle 610629 10.6 %
Arm Tentacle 508834 8.8 %
Regenerative Blood 322337 5.6 %
Blistering Tentacle 267815 4.6 %
Elementium Bolt 125745 2.2 %
Deathwing 104040 1.8 %
Elementium Fragment 80796 1.4 %
Spirit Link Totem 78065 1.4 %
last week Halbarad:
Actor Amount
Mutated Corruption 1999423 31.4 %
Wing Tentacle 1000220 15.7 %
Deathwing 727974 11.4 %
Regenerative Blood 675883 10.6 %
Arm Tentacle 577049 9.1 %
Arm Tentacle 411358 6.5 %
Elementium Terror 350021 5.5 % Blistering Tentacle 285499 4.5 %
Elementium Fragment 154941 2.4 %
Elementium Bolt 127629 2.0 %
Spirit Link Totem 59578 0.9 %
This week Whitey:
Actor Amount
Mutated Corruption 2207969 35.7 %
Wing Tentacle 932970 15.1 %
Elementium Terror 890109 14.4 % Deathwing 706113 11.4 %
Arm Tentacle 447176 7.2 %
Arm Tentacle 440998 7.1 %
Blistering Tentacle 237183 3.8 %
Elementium Bolt 112727 1.8 %
Regenerative Blood 87889 1.4 %
Elementium Fragment 79036 1.3 %
Spirit Link Totem 33291 0.5 %
Spirit Link Totem 17718 0.3 %
Last week whitey:
Actor Amount
Mutated Corruption 2846368 39.2 %
Elementium Terror 1477907 20.3 % Wing Tentacle 1000739 13.8 %
Deathwing 755946 10.4 %
Arm Tentacle 493172 6.8 %
Arm Tentacle 338247 4.7 %
Blistering Tentacle 231625 3.2 %
Elementium Bolt 59430 0.8 %
Spirit Link Totem 41721 0.6 %
Regenerative Blood 21747 0.3 %
Total this week: 753993 + 890109 = 1644102
Total last week: 350021 + 1477907 = 1827928
The kill last week was faster by 45 seconds.
Quote from: Slush;342792Any thoughts on these numbers? Its seems to me like the numbers Hal was getting on last nights try was... WAY to high to heal through.
And 5 stacks? In pretty much the same amount of time? Was the Elementium Terror staying up for 1 second too long? Was Hal hit from behind (no block)? Was he using any CD's on that kill that he didnt use yesterday? Look at the timers here.. 12:20 last week. 13:01 this week. Are we falling behind on dps?
Lets see, last week we did not lose anyone and we could just nuke the crap out of the boss.
This week we lost Torgen and a tank ( twice ).
The reason we took longer is because we lost torgen when still on the adds! so the last nuking phase we were missing the top dps!
This has NOTHING to do with the DPS and its getting abit anoying that you keep trowing it at that. ( i even popped cooldowns on the adds instead at on the boss )
And PLEASE check whitey's logs as well and not just Hal, like i copyed above. last week whitey was the one getting the beating.
[22:46:04.062] Hubbah's Serpent Sting fades from Elementium Fragment = Hubbah stopped dps on Fragments (they died)
Terrors spawn:
[22:46:04.489] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[22:46:04.489] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 12284 (R: 5850)
Hal pulls Elementium Terror:
[22:46:05.015] Halbarad hits Elementium Terror 6144
Torgen starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:07.687] Torgen casts Rend on Elementium Terror
TL starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:07.775] Teaell casts Shadow Word: Pain on Elementium Terror
Hubbah starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:09.018] Hubbah casts Serpent Sting on Elementium Terror
Leggs starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:09.217] Leggs crits Elementium Terror *13391*
Incéndia starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:11.516] Incéndia casts Living Bomb on Elementium Terror
Hal is at 2 stacks when the dps starts on Terrors? Please correct me if Im wrong, but should dps start sooner?
And for the record:
Last weeks kill:
[21:55:31.015] Whytee afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[21:55:32.291] Hubbah casts Serpent Sting on Elementium Terror
Quote from: hubbah;342797And PLEASE check whitey's logs as well and not just Hal, like i copyed above. last week whitey was the one getting the beating.
Why was Whytee gettting the stacks and the hits last week? Tanks did not mention that they would do anything different that would cause this.
I might be missing a mechanic here :)
Quote from: Slush;342799[22:46:04.062] Hubbah's Serpent Sting fades from Elementium Fragment = Hubbah stopped dps on Fragments (they died)
Terrors spawn:
[22:46:04.489] Halbarad afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[22:46:04.489] Elementium Terror Tetanus Halbarad 12284 (R: 5850)
Hal pulls Elementium Terror:
[22:46:05.015] Halbarad hits Elementium Terror 6144
Torgen starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:07.687] Torgen casts Rend on Elementium Terror
TL starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:07.775] Teaell casts Shadow Word: Pain on Elementium Terror
Hubbah starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:09.018] Hubbah casts Serpent Sting on Elementium Terror
Leggs starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:09.217] Leggs crits Elementium Terror *13391*
Incéndia starts dps on Elementium Terror:
[22:46:11.516] Incéndia casts Living Bomb on Elementium Terror
Hal is at 2 stacks when the dps starts on Terrors? Please correct me if Im wrong, but should dps start sooner?
Check the other Terror? And as soon as the skull is on the dps is on the terror just like all other weeks.
Quote from: Slush;342800Why was Whytee gettting the stacks and the hits last week?
No idea, im not a tank and i dont set the skull.
Im just a mindless zombie hitting the skull :).
Thats a question i can not answer, but as you can see the dmg taken last week was ALOT higher then this week and then we survived?
Quote from: hubbah;342802Check the other Terror? And as soon as the skull is on the dps is on the terror just like all other weeks.
Thats for both terrors.
Quote from: Slush;342804Thats for both terrors.
And checked last week?
Quote from: hubbah;342806And checked last week?
Last weeks kill:
[21:55:31.015] Whytee afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[21:55:32.291] Hubbah casts Serpent Sting on Elementium Terror
Quote from: Slush;342807Last weeks kill:
[21:55:31.015] Whytee afflicted by Tetanus from Elementium Terror
[21:55:32.291] Hubbah casts Serpent Sting on Elementium Terror
So we were 3 seconds slower, im a 100% sure thats not the reason for the wipes.
You are staring at the wrong thing.
Im gonna call it quits here, you can find all the data underneath, ill speak to you on thursday!
Isn't the debuff applied through hits (each hit = stack)? So if tanks just happened to avoid a few hits last week where they got hit this week...
Seems to me that within the timeframes we're looking at it's hard to make changes as they're so small. I'm no healer but since the damage is so high and 100% expected, isn't this the point where you just chain your biggest heals on the tank?
Quote from: hubbah;342808So we were 3 seconds slower, im a 100% sure thats not the reason for the wipes.
You are staring at the wrong thing.
Thats 3 seconds more time for Terrors to hit the tanks, thats 3 more seconds of intense healing. Thats probably two more stacks than necessary. No, Im not staring at the wrong thing. Im looking through logs. Also healing logs to find out why this is happening. We didnt have Jas and his insane hots yesterday. Maybe we need to adapt to that aswell? There are numerous of issues, but starting the dps 3 seconds later on the most hardest hitting mob in the game (this far) is not good enough in my eyes... And my eyes are looking at the sillyness of my HW instead of GHW aswell.
Im not blaming anyone, Im trying to find answers.
If you didnt get frustrated over TS yesterday and made your post, this wouldnt have been brought up.
I am 100% sure the late start on dps on Terrors is a _PART_ of the wipes.
I guess to remedy that we could start hitting things regardless of skull or not. Once a skull is up we then switch (or stay on target).
Rather than start dps then switch to skull once it appears if you are on the wrong one.........why not always choose one tanks target to burn as the first to go - say Whytee's - and then it is always the right mob rather than wait for a mark.
The plan for me at that point is to pump my heals into the tanks alternately ( or as required if one tank is taking more of a beating ) whilst the other 2 healers are pumping what they can into their own tanks.......so it works out at 1.5 healer per tank.
I have no great insight into what happened last night........but one thing that did stand out was that we had no res capability - so maybe we have to be sure to take at least one char capable of combat res.
Quote from: Niel;342841Rather than start dps then switch to skull once it appears if you are on the wrong one.........why not always choose one tanks target to burn as the first to go - say Whytee's - and then it is always the right mob rather than wait for a mark.
I think I suggested this when we were still wiping on this, but it was refuted for some reason. I can't recall what though ^^
Iirc Whitey's is always the skull, so aren't we doing that anyway? However I think we might have double stacks in there somewhere hence the huge damage. Not had a chance to look yet other than at the exceprts posted here.
Coming to get you.
RGW.
Pretty much all the points you need to know are in the video!
I'm assuming from the logs that RGW met a hasted bolt on platform 4 last night?
Jesus H. Christ, look at the DPS differences... our 1st kill I was on 44k, last one we did I was on 57k. 13k just from gear o.O
Quote from: Azunai;343495Jesus H. Christ, look at the DPS differences... our 1st kill I was on 44k, last one we did I was on 57k. 13k just from my OP sword o.O
Fixed :D hahahahaha
I also blame [ITEM=http://www.wowhead.com/item=78002]Bone-Link Fetish[/ITEM]
well ye, and you got used to the fight abit more :) all in all nice dps increase! ( you got ranked on that fight as wel :) )
Yes we did TL and 3-4 people were basically stood where it landed so b00m they died. We had a few attempts and they were good.Last week we diidnt get off the 1st platform and in 2 attempts we made it to the 4th. I know there is a nerf but still :P
I told every 1 to watch RGT's video and to listen to it and watch the positioning for the tentacle to avoid excess raid damage as 3-4 people were getting hit at 1 time when it slams the platform.
Quote from: TeaLeaf;343484I'm assuming from the logs that RGW met a hasted bolt on platform 4 last night?
Yeah. We had 1 person standing in the bolt's landing zone and 2-3 others nearby. I think we could change the order to fit with the raid.
Blue Dragon: How are the healers finding the fight (apart from the bolt landing)? Are you comftable enough to do without the healing buff?
Green Dragon: Dies 1st as the buff isn;t the best help. Can see it's uses for a hasted bolt but the yellow buff is better for that.
Yellow: May be worth considering to have it 3rd or 4th to get more control over the bolt as it seems to be the only thing that cases us bother.
Red Dragon: We didn't get a go at single target killing the zits and I for one would like to kill it to see how we do. If we can handle them then taking it out earlier might work in our favour.
tl;dr
1) Do the healers think they can survive without healing buff so blue can be killed earlier?
2) Can we try killing the red dragon earlier so we can see how we do against the zits compared to the fast bolt?
Quote from: Treach;343597Blue Dragon: How are the healers finding the fight (apart from the bolt landing)? Are you comftable enough to do without the healing buff?
Green Dragon: Dies 1st as the buff isn;t the best help. Can see it's uses for a hasted bolt but the yellow buff is better for that.
Yellow: May be worth considering to have it 3rd or 4th to get more control over the bolt as it seems to be the only thing that cases us bother.
Red Dragon: We didn't get a go at single target killing the zits and I for one would like to kill it to see how we do. If we can handle them then taking it out earlier might work in our favour.
tl;dr
1) Do the healers think they can survive without healing buff so blue can be killed earlier?
2) Can we try killing the red dragon earlier so we can see how we do against the zits compared to the fast bolt?
Not sure you've got the colours the right way around?
Blue is a DPS buff not a healing buff
Green is a healing buff and nothing to do with the bolt
Yellow should be 3rd already - were you killing it 1st or 2nd?
From the first page the colours & buffs are:
NPC BuffsYsera - +20% healing, Dream Spell
Alexstrasza - +20% HP and destroys all Burning Tentacles in P1, lowers damage from Corrupted Blood in P2
Nozdormu - +20% haste & Time Zone (slows bolt, -50% attack speed)
Kalecgos - +20% DPS buff, +splash damage on each attack
The video shows the RGT kill order of:
Green
Red
Yellow
Blue
This leaves platform 3 & 4 where Blistering adds need to be taken out, and only platform 4 gets the massive unslowed bolt explosion.
The RGT video has notes in it explaining how to deal with the hasted bolt, raid groups nearer claw/wing (away from landing zone of bolt), use a Raidwall like DG/Spirit link for the Bolt landing, PS or tank CD for the immediate MT damage, then burn the Bolt down whilst you AOE heal.
Read. had another go at 25 man and really looking fwd to this
Quote from: Treach;343597Yeah. We had 1 person standing in the bolt's landing zone and 2-3 others nearby. I think we could change the order to fit with the raid.
Blue Dragon: How are the healers finding the fight (apart from the bolt landing)? Are you comftable enough to do without the healing buff?
Green Dragon: Dies 1st as the buff isn;t the best help. Can see it's uses for a hasted bolt but the yellow buff is better for that.
Yellow: May be worth considering to have it 3rd or 4th to get more control over the bolt as it seems to be the only thing that cases us bother.
Red Dragon: We didn't get a go at single target killing the zits and I for one would like to kill it to see how we do. If we can handle them then taking it out earlier might work in our favour.
tl;dr
1) Do the healers think they can survive without healing buff so blue can be killed earlier?
2) Can we try killing the red dragon earlier so we can see how we do against the zits compared to the fast bolt?
The benefit in the blue lies in its 20% damage buff. It's why we're killing it last in RGT. Take out the blue and you might very well struggle on the last before Cataclysm. If the bolt is a big issue though, you could try it. I know RGT is now miles ahead on dps, and you might be as well as you've spent longer gearing up before this fight. The order would then be Green->Red->Blue->Bronze
Sorry got things mixed up. My 2nd question remains though. We killed yellow 2nd and red 3rd. The hasted bolt killed us. Can we at least make yellow 3rd and red 2nd just to see?
Quote from: Treach;343617Sorry got things mixed up. My 2nd question remains though. We killed yellow 2nd and red 3rd. The hasted bolt killed us. Can we at least make yellow 3rd and red 2nd just to see?
2 haste bolts in 1 fight is veeery tricky cooldown-wise. I'd move bronze to 3rd at least, otherwise 4th. The blisterings are really not hard as long as you jump them as soon as they spawn (use target labels, can't miss em).
Quote from: Treach;343617Sorry got things mixed up. My 2nd question remains though. We killed yellow 2nd and red 3rd. The hasted bolt killed us. Can we at least make yellow 3rd and red 2nd just to see?
Those changes would then match the RGT kill order, so yes I'd agree with you Treach. I had not realised that RGW were trying a different order.
No point in reinventing the wheel eh!
Sent using Tapatalk & thumbs.
@AZ - if I now understand Treach correctly, he did not mean change Blue from 4th
Sent using Tapatalk & thumbs.
Quote from: TeaLeaf;343621@AZ - if I now understand Treach correctly, he did not mean change Blue from 4th
Sent using Tapatalk & thumbs.
It's a suggestion though, if they are really struggling with haste bolt but making the DPS curve ok :-)
Yeah but 2 hasted botls is nasty from a healing POV :blink:
Quote from: TeaLeaf;343630Yeah but 2 hasted botls is nasty from a healing POV :blink:
No, my suggestion was: Green -> Red -> Blue -> Bronze. So they have no hasted bolts at all :-) Provided they have the DPS to settle it, they could try it, if they have trouble with the hasted bolt mechanic.
Riad tactics for monday should stay the same atm imo. We had 2 attemps on DW and on the second one the hasted bolt killed us. So let's keep practicing with the current tactics that got us to the last platform so quickly, and if those keep failing we can switch some things around.
So what is the current rgw kill order? It's not clear from the above.
Sent using Tapatalk & thumbs.
Quote from: Treach;343617We killed yellow 2nd and red 3rd. The hasted bolt killed us.
So I gather they're killing Green -> Bronze -> Red -> Blue at the moment.
Quote from: Azunai;343642So I gather they're killing Green -> Bronze -> Red -> Blue at the moment.
Correct.
Green-Yellow-Red-Blue will work sure, but from RGT's pov is a slightly harder way of doing it due to the strain placed on healers and their CDs. Having 2 mass AOE healing platforms then the Phase 2 platform burns a ton of mana and CDs which you then need on 3 consecutive platforms rather than just 2 consecutive platforms with the RGT order. That's why RGT take what we believe is a less painful choice of having to deal with the Blazings on the 3rd platform instead of a hasted bolt.
When we went for DW the other night we had enough time to have a couple attempts....mainly we wanted to get the bolt down as we failed terribly on it.
We kinda went free for all after that...
Ive told everyone to watch the RGT video as we will be doing the order as you guys do for the reasons above and then it makes it easier to compare logs.....
EDIT Also if we are having problems and doing it the same way as RGT it will be easier to ask for help and tell you where we are etc
Best attempt got to 5pc a really good night raiding, next week sucka is going down
Was the 5% wipe due to the increasing AOE or Terrors?
Yup he'll go down soon enough! Phase 1 seems to go pretty well now, just need to smooth out some stuff like spreading on the big worm (that loves me so much :narnar:), the aoe moments, dps on blistering tentacles,..
The stacking on platform 4 when we got a fast bolt was nice, tnx deri for that tip :D.
It might be good to keep hero for the very last 10% in phase2, but then we should all use our cd's/trinkets/potions for the last claw since we only had about 15 seconds left on cataclysm last time, but this was with hero.. Also IF we'd do this, since this is a long fight we can use hero at the very start of p1. Not that we need it but if we can use it twice, why not :D
PS: TeaLeaf what addon you use for enemy nameplates?
think we had 3 or 4 ppl dead after the second set of terrors died, so well we tried burning deathwing but he went berserk at about 5%
Quote from: Cynba;343805PS: TeaLeaf what addon you use for enemy nameplates?
http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/tidy-plates
Re heroism:
You can bump heroism to P2 if you have the margin on dps to beat the timer on the 4th platform. When RGT did it for the first time we were only a few seconds ahead of the Cataclysm even with using heroism, so using it on P2 was not an option. If post-nerf beating the timer on platform 4 is not an issue then I would leave heroism until you start your 11.5% burn in P2. Whether 15 seconds si enough I'm not sure, I suspect it might be (RGT was 1-2 seconds ahead as a pre-nerf first kill comparison).
Re the deaths: looking at your 2 best tries there seems to be a pattern:
Try 11:
-Moonslash to Shrapnell
-both tanks to Terrors
-wipe followed
Try 10:
-Nims to Shrapnell
-both tanks to Terrors
-wipe followed
So, it seems like you lose people to Shrapnell (easy problem to fix if you all click the button at the right time), and you lose both tanks to Terrors. The wipe follows once the tanks are down. So the challenge is to fix the Terror DPS and to sort some CDs for the terror tanks when stacks get high.
Assign one tank's target as the focus DPS target and burn it down super fast.
Make sure that DPS have an assist macro for the Terrors to ensure you hit the right DPS target as soon as the chosen tank has it. A two second delay in starting dps will mean a tank death and that will almost certainly means the other tank will also die due to being hit by both Terrors.
It is *seriously important* to not have either tank hit by both Terrors, so tanks should be split apart before they spawn to make sure you do not pull initial aggro from both. RGT had several wipes due to this recently and the only thing we could see in the logs was double the hits normally expected (ie 2 x Terrors hitting a tank instead of 1 x Terror).
As Tetanus stacks build, do not be afraid to use CDs on keeping the tank alive (e.g. barksin, SI, ShWa, PS, pala HoP/HoS etc). Yes you're trying to hold some raidwalls back for end P2, but a dead tank means you will die anyway!
HTH.
Yup my timer bars actually cover the "button of love" so ive got those moved now and it hotkeyed now so i wont miss it again.
We were assigning Sharps target to go down first,marking it with a skull...Your right people were not quick enough swapping targets so he kept going down then would Treach..wipe.. As you say Tl we need to get the dps on them asap...I use tidy plates also and its great.once its installed all you do is press "v" or which ever brings up the mobs bar on your own setup....it shows all your ticks on it and such but it just makes it easier to swap targets. So please if you dont have it or similar get it!
Healing wise we are fine.In P2 we have pretty much all our raidwalls ready for use. We were having mana issues to start but that was due to people being in a line for curruption slam but we have that sorted now.
Looking forward to looting your shinies tonight.
Sincerely,
One of your killers.
And please take nims with you, at the end!
:narnar:
As RGW are hammering hard on the door that is the final boss in Dragon Soul, I thought it salient to point out this:
RGT's first kill of Madness had a total of 375k rdps.
Since then the boss has had a 5% nerf.
The worst dps recorded last night during the RGW raid was 380k rdps.
YOU (RGW) HAVE THE DPS, it just may not be hitting the right thing at the right time with the right spell.
(the following comments are using the best try last night which was 3-4 seconds from Phase 2)
So, having shown that you already have the dps let's do some group analysis:
Blistering Tentacle DPS:
This is where you lose time on the 3rd & 4th platform, handling waves of Blistering adds. There's way too much variance in dps here which means people are either targeting the wrong thing or using the wrong cast.
Nims - 801k
Hermi - 733k
Cynba - 721k
Sith - 356k
Hanne - 344k
!! pre-assigning melee to center, splitting ranged dps to focus left & right will help reduce this, as will choosing quick casts where you are not the only one on the target. This should bring Hanne's & Sith's dps up substantially, which in turn means that the raid can then return to dps the Arm/Wing to beat the Cataclysm timer. That's at least 5 seconds, probably closer to 10 seconds to be saved here per platform.
Regenerative Blood DPS
The key to killing these quickly is to have them grouped up at the toenail so that the Arm/Wing gets splash damage at the same time. If healers stand there then that's where all the bloods will head and this makes it real easy to dps them down. However we have people not making best use of their dps here and here's the evidence:
RGT uses 15m damage to kill the adds in this fight
RGW in your best try used 22.5m to kill the adds, so you wasted 7.5m damage on the Bloods by not killing them before they regenerated their health.
Sharpfang - 5.5m
Cynba - 4.4m
Hermi - 4.1m
Hanne - 2.9m
Sith - 2.5m
Nims - 1.9m
Deriánez - 0.9m
There are class reasons why some will never top this table, Nims for example is doing about the right level of dps here for his class, but Sith & Deri can up there dps hugely on this which means the bloods to not Regen to full health, which in turn means they die in 15m damage and do not take 22.5m damage. I realise that Deri is out of spec last night, but we should all know that bloods need to die asap. 7.5m @ say 500k rdps (allowing for AOE) spread over 4 platforms is a saving of at least 4 seconds per platform. This change alone would have got you past platform 4 last night and into Phase 2.
Elementium Bolt
Let's deal with the DPS but first: if you blow heroism for the tentacle on platform 4 then you can kill it before you get to the bolt which helps HUGELY as it allows people to position correctly for the AOE bolt damage. The key here is the difference in damage on platform 4 when the hasted bolt hits:
RGT take about 1.2m damage
RGW take 2.2m damage
So, RGW need to group around and in range of their raid wall on time. Don't stack too early (or you'll all get Crush damage), but be spread within range of the chosen CD and sufficiently far enough away from the landing point so that when the bolt arrives you can run into position before it lands. YES, you can see the bolt arrive, it does not just materialise on the platform and go bang! So watch for the bolt coming whilst DPSing the tentacle, start moving towards the assigned collapse point when the bolt is due and make sure you are in range of the raidwall before the bolt hits! The assigned raidwall healer can be watching for the bolt (turn your camera as you are already stood in the assigned collapse point) and hit it when the bolt comes in and BEFORE it lands. Same for the Healer CD (tranq in your case).
Finally, all dps should be using the macro given in the video to help them IMMEDIATELY burn the Bolt down. Gather, hit macro, burn bolt and spread to minimise follow-on Crush damage. The extra damage taken is partly poor mitigation, partly poor dps.
PLATFORM 4 3/4
This platform is all about raid efficiency; hitting the right thing at the right time and not wasting anything. DPS is not the issue for RGW at the moment, it's inefficiency with the DPS or cooldowns you already have. Use them effectively and I think I have shown you that Phase 2 is something you can and should be returning to on each attempt.
Along the way we've also saved almost 40 seconds on the enrage timer for Phase 2 use.
Phase 2
Once you are into Phase 2 the fight turns to one of control. Kill the adds with the utmost efficiency, single target one Terror down ASAP, then burn the other. Then time your entry into the sub-10% world and make sure you can burn continuously from 10% to the kill. Time your entry poorly and you'll end up with Terrors raping the raid and wiping. Timing it correctly (ie having the boss HP at the right level to push through 10% as soon as the last Terror is down) is the way to a smooth kill (chain your raid walls as required towards the end of the fight).
Madness will be yours if you tighten up on these elements of the fight.
Macro help
I have one macro which I have bound to hotkey ('F' in this instance) which helps me target things I think I need help targeting quicker. It changes over time to reflect the fights I am doing, but here is what it looks like currently:
/target Elementium Bolt
/target Burning Tendons
/target molten
/target right
/target Obnoxious
/target blazing
/target Flail
/target Eye
The way the macro works is that it will try to target the first name in the list and if not found will try to target the second name in the list, and if not found will try to target the third name in the list, and so on. I strongly recommend that all dps have something like this. As you can see, it works for a number of fights, not just Madness.
Green Button Problems
If you have problems clicking green buttons for Shrapnell, use this macro on a hotkey.
/click ExtraActionButton1
Hope this helps RGW.
That does help me a lot TL ty
nice I didn't know about multiple lines for the target macro, always used 1 line which I edited before each fight :) will save some time :narnar:
Platform 4 Elementium Bolt - In RGT as i am usually the gather point for Healing Rain/Spirit Link totem......i use the boss mod timer bar that shows Elementium Bolt Explosion time to decide my cast time for Healing Rain/Spirit Link so both are down fractionally before the bolt lands and goes boom i then make sure to target alternately melee ( who are first out of the aoe healing ) and ranged with chain heal to top back up......with of course the focus to spread back out asap once the bolt is gone.......timing is critical here as if the tentacle is still up a Crush on a large group would be painful.
Obviously swap out my rain + spirit link for whatever raid wall and healing CD that you are using ....but the timing of it can be pretty much nailed to a fraction of a second before bolt explosion.
Quote from: Niel;344470Platform 4 Elementium Bolt - In RGT as i am usually the gather point for Healing Rain/Spirit Link totem......i use the boss mod timer bar that shows Elementium Bolt Explosion time to decide my cast time for Healing Rain/Spirit Link so both are down fractionally before the bolt lands and goes boom i then make sure to target alternately melee ( who are first out of the aoe healing ) and ranged with chain heal to top back up......with of course the focus to spread back out asap once the bolt is gone.......timing is critical here as if the tentacle is still up a Crush on a large group would be painful.
I did just this for the first time yesterday in RGT, and it worked like a charm.
For RGW, that does not have a healing shammy, maybe a DG-AM-Tranq at this point will carry you safely through this phase?
Normally they/we use Barrier and a Tranq. However I might start using my SLT now aswell :P.
i use rallying cry also when we gather for the last bolt. as weve seen pointed out here, its more about people not hitting the right thing, rather than not doing high nuff dps.
gz guys, well done tonight. and gz with the mount, Erive :)
grats to killing the little hatchling :D ops! I mean the big ugly dragon DW .. well done :yahoo:
Gz for tonight.....
We still had to use 2 rgt alts to get the kill,not that they bolstered us(no offence) but we had to use them for certain reasons.
I want a RGW kill next week!
Sorry for the swapping about and taking others instead of yourself,but I had a trial in and we had some dps issues....Next raid week i will get the RGW members in who dont have the kill and a full RGW grp :)
yahhooo gtz to RGW
I am happy to keep fighting, or sitting on this boss until all RGW have the kill.
p.s. in all the excitement I messed up the dkp tonight but will sort it soon...
Good kill last night. Very clean, just 1 thing to note: Tentacle targeting. Even though the targeting was repeated (melee on closet, ranged on furthest) I don;t think people paid attention to it. Every time it was the furtherst away tentacles that were not taking any damage until someone called on TS for them. Every. Damn. Time.
I know this kill is just going to get easier, but please can we try to do it so wipes aren't an option?
Yup targeting issues again.....took almost a full night to down DW....if we want to run hcs and a dw kill we need him dead in 2-3 pulls max
Great kill last night. ranged starting to notice the tentacles at the back, after it gets called on TS.