Dead Men Walking

So we have just pushed past the $100k mark in the group bank, well done all :thumb:

We now need to start to plan what aircraft we ought to purchase when we have enough money.  Obviously something like the size of the King Air 350 would be more profitable due to its capacity.

Has anyone got any suggestions on what aircraft we should get? Bare in mind that it would need to be something that all members can use so it would either need to be an FSX default aircraft or something that is freeware that can easily downloaded.  

Also keep an eye out for any 'bargains' on aircraft that you spot.

To find out what aircrafts are available in FSEconomy.

Press Home in the FSEconomy main page, select Aircraft Models,
 and on the next page select Open Table view.

My suggestion regarding plane would have to be the Cessna 208 Caravan. That is available as default in FSX. I saw at least three in Europe for sale for about 750000. It takes 13 passenger and about 1500kg cargo. Is a single with fixed gear and simple to fly, yet cruises faster than some smaller planes like the 337 and the 206.

There is two Carenado versions One with G1000 and one "semi steam" version.

Lovely plane!

Other than that I would suggest to lease planes in the beginning if the lease prices are like the one I got. 7000 for a C206, 20000 for a King Air C90. If Dead Men would refund half of a months lease, everyone could use the plane they like from the start. I don't see my self using group planes unless they where assigned to me for a extended period of time. But don't get med wrong, I think we should have a group plane to let new ones test. But that could be a 172 as that one is in by default both in FSX and X-plane.

What I would like for Dead Men was to consentrate on buying a base or bases. That would realy give us something to work together on.

I'll be honest and say I'd prefer something a little larger, mainly get the additional range.   Fill up a Caravan and the range tumbles.   Put the same 14 people in say a Carenado B1900D then you can still go a long way without refuelling and also have the option to do larger flights on the shorter range.   I've not looked into loads of planes though, so DYOR! :P

Whatever we get I'll probably end up getting the Carenado version (or other HQ version).  Been quite impressed with what I have seen of theirs.

I agree that the B1900 is a better plane, but it is twice the price, a twin and needs a copilot. It is not easy to know what is the best.

This is why I would like us to help finane each others planes, and build bases instead of a fleet of planes.

It needs a copilot?

....and I have no idea about bases.   Explain or linky please so I can heducate me-self!

Quote from: TeaLeaf;394897It needs a copilot?

....and I have no idea about bases.   Explain or linky please so I can heducate me-self!

Yes, a copilot or Addtl Crew as it is labeled here (example B1900D for sale): http://www.fseconomy.net:81/aircraftlog.jsp?id=3594
I think it is just a matter of paying her wages. :-)

Here is some FBO info (the manual):
https://sites.google.com/site/fseoperationsguide/fbos/creating-buying-selling-fbos

Edit:
FBO Operations
https://sites.google.com/site/fseoperationsguide/fbos/fbo-operations

basically if it is 2 man crewed you will also need to hire a virtual co pilot

Ah ok, I did not know that, I assumed it was like the solo pilot A380 goodness of the rest of FSX!   In which case, I'll chane my mind and drop down to a single pilot plane as my preferred.  If the King 350 works and has more capacity than the Caravan, why not stick with the 350?

Yes,
The 350 might be a good alternative, as it is fast, is in the default FSX and handles 14 passengers.
A virtual money machine! :-)

Id be happy with having a 350, will check for some prices later on tonight to see what we need

Quote from: Sparko;394908Id be happy with having a 350, will check for some prices later on tonight to see what we need

They're about $950k - $1.05m, depending on where you buy and how many hours on the airframe.   For example:

Spain........$939,000 - 587hrs
Kansas......$948,000 - 243hrs
Idaho........$950,000 - 486hrs
Australia....$955,000 - 151hrs

Personally I reckon it might be fun to run one back from wherever, picking up jobs along the way.

Still looking at FBOs and I'm not massively convinced they do anything for us, they are certainly an overhead though that needs constant upkeep.   Someone enlighten me please!

Quote from: TeaLeaf;394920Still looking at FBOs and I'm not massively convinced they do anything for us, they are certainly an overhead though that needs constant upkeep.
Someone enlighten me please!

I can't enlighten you, but my idea is something like this:

Yes, they do need upkeep. But that is our job. Not knowing how it all works, I can only speculate, but lets say we had a spot (or two) somewhere in Northern Europe.
We had repair shop. Had a gate, sold fuel, supplies etc.
When our planes needed 100hrs service or needed other maintenance, we went there to let our shop do it. Maybe we could get a discount?
We sometime fly in cheap fuel from the mideast or africa to maximize profit.
And we fly in supplies on a regular basis. We take extra care of our own passengers, making sure they gets a seat first.
I do not know how all this works, but what I have understood is that this could give us more to work for together.
There is of course no reason not to do this with a Dead Men plane or two. I just think the main focus should be on FBO's.

What I am afraid of is that it all goes in to a race for bigger and faster planes as our account gets bigger and bigger. I'd rather fly in supplies to our base in ??? in a Cessna 172  than race around trying to find 50 pax for my next flight so I can buy the next big thing.

But this is only my humble opinion.

Edit:
List of FBO's for sale
http://www.fseconomy.net:81/marketfbo.jsp

there are 3 gates open for rent in the uk, if you use the fbo maps and tick ates for rent...does that mean we can start a fbo...im all up for starting a hub..if you look at the fbos for sale they go all the way up to 12mil, then the last one is 1 billion, really?

Personally I'd prefer us to get a few planes available within the group before we look at FBO's.  Without having any aircraft I can't understand what we would use the FBO's for? Unless I'm missing something.

I have no issues with us a some point getting a few FBO's but I dont think at this early time it would be the more beneficial option (also without knowing fully what owning one will entail)

Ideally it would be nice to have a mixture of different size aircraft so that every person in the group will have the opportunity to fly their preferred aircraft.

It's early days yet but I really do think our first priority should be owning our own aircraft, after all one of our largest overheads is rental costs.

I think we should step back and make sure we understand what FBOs are and how they interact with passengers, assignments and airport services before we commit to one.

There's not a great deal of racing for bigger aircraft to be had even if you want to because the aircraft are pretty much all small or medium size.  So I'm not worried we're jumping into a race for anything bigger, I just want to understand the choice before committing to an FBO.  Along the way we might also upgrade aircraft (which appears not to take too long at all).

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

If you want the one in Austraila I quite happy to fly it back for you :) Might not be as pristine when it get back, but I will do my best !!

Quote from: TeaLeaf;394930I think we should step back and make sure we understand what FBOs are

Yes I agree with that, but I think a base over time would give us better opportunities for cooperative gaming.

Quote from: TeaLeaf;394920They're about $950k - $1.05m, depending on where you buy and how many hours on the airframe.   For example:

Spain........$939,000 - 587hrs
Kansas......$948,000 - 243hrs
Idaho........$950,000 - 486hrs
Australia....$955,000 - 151hrs

We've got $118,000 in the dMw bank at the moment, so we have plenty of time to discuss this!   Even if we buy/build an FBO it will take a while to build as even the smallest version needs 10,000kg of 'stuff' for construction to begin.

I have found something that could be a good 350 model. I is Early Access but being sold.
http://milviz.com/flight/products/KA350/index.php

Looks good, but I got put off by two things:

1. price - if it is still in development I'd want a discount please and $50 doesn't seem like a discounted 'help us develop the model' price.
2.

QuoteSystem Requirements (Minimum):

OS: Windows Vista, Windows 7 (use in all other versions of Windows is unsupported)

Seriously?  No Windows 8?

I liked the pictures and it looks good, but.......

Interior:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20842697/KA350_interior.html

Just seen this on their forums too:

QuoteThis product will not yet work in FSX:SE

Quote from: TeaLeaf;394978Just seen this on their forums too:
This product will not yet work in FSX:SE

And for that reason I'm not willing to invest, so I'm out....

what about a b200? and its steam friendly..bit steep on price though


http://www.flight1.com/products.asp?product=f1b200fsx

found this at flightsim.com, its free and there are 5 in the uk

FSX Embraer EMB120 Brasilia

http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/fslib.php?do=copyright&fid=151689  (http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/fslib.php?do=copyright&fid=151689)  for the download
   
http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/fsview.php?do=image&fid=151689&idx=2   for the picture

Tealeaf!

Here is something that looks like a good Jetstream. Maybe it is too good?

Anyway this is the stuff I love.
http://www.precisionmanuals.com/pages/product/FSX/js4100.html

I have that aircraft vobler and it is epic

some other alternatives?

https://www.virtualcol.com/products/productos.php

just flight are having a 5 day pick and save..

http://www.justflight.com/bundle

was looking at buying the tristar and the a320 for £12, then buying the tristar upgrade to professional for £14, so for a total of £26 I get an a320 and the tristar professional(it updates the original). and btw the tristar professional is retailing at £34.99 so saving £8

already have the 146, which is nice and the lightning and comet

I've previously picked up several bits from Just Flight, so you tempted me into looking at the bundle.  

As I already had the A320, I went for the 737 Professional and the Tristar for the bundle, then added the Tristar Professional upgrade.   Oh, and a Majestic Software Dash 8 Q-400 Pilot Edition somehow slipped into the basket too.  No idea how that happened, honest! :whistle:


My previous JustFlight purchases:
146-200/300 Jetliner
A400M Airlifter
A340-500/600
A320 Jetliner
757 Captain
Battle of Britain - 70th Anniversary
767-200/300 Series

Quote from: TeaLeaf;395073Majestic Software Dash 8 Q-400 Pilot Edition somehow slipped into the basket too.  No idea how that happened, honest! :whistle:

....and damn, is it ever nice!   A lot of learning to do though compared to the standard planes in FSX.   Even getting ready to take off is several minutes of work!

me and vob have that aircraft, joy to fly and a joy to start as well

Quote from: sulky_uk;395075me and vob have that aircraft, joy to fly and a joy to start as well

Too bad its not directly compatible with FSE. But I think some people have made it work.

I want to suggest a couple of other planes.

The Pilatus PC-12. I got the Carenado version a few days a go, tried it yesterday, and think it might be a great FSE plane. Cruises at 270 knots up high, and 230 down low.

The other one is the Quest Kodiak from Lionheart. It is like a smaller version of the C208 Caravan by a few seats, but nimbler and faster. The textures isn't Carenado quality, but it is cheaper and handles like a dream. Class cockpit.


Edit:

Link to FSE forum about Q400 tips
http://www.fseconomy.net/forum/fsx/7884-majestic-q400-questions?limitstart=0#44424

List of leases to check out:

http://www.fseconomy.net/forum/mp-aircraft/14987-30-aircraft-available-for-lease#80221

Hopefully this will help with aircraft choice. links to all downloads for aircraft used in FSE.


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtL0mW3w1tLqdEcyOFIwRkgyRUltMFV6aFRkNURPaVE#gid=9

Quote from: vobler;395087Too bad its not directly compatible with FSE. But I think some people have made it work.

Yes it is!

Quote from: JustFlightMajestic Software Dash 8 Q400 Pilot Edition

V1.014 Update

What is new in this update?

Update issued: 20 March 2015

+ Fixed the problem with Q400 crash on resize under Prepar3D 2.5 when
mipmap panels option is off
+ Fixed the Prepar3D audio problems in the Cabin views Modification to
+ the copy protection, allowing usage of the Q400 under
several simulators on the same PC
+ Fixed the non-transparent windows in the Cabin views when the cockpit
dome light is activated
+ Aileron to Tiller control will disengage at 50 percent Power Levers
angle, and center automatically for takeoff

The v1.014 update includes all previous updates, including the Flight Simulator X:Steam Edition compatiblity which was introduced in v1.012

Quote from: TeaLeaf;396662Yes it is!

I was talking about FSEconomy. The steam version of FSX is usually written FSX:SE.

The way they have coded that plane, mostly outside of FSX (to overcome limitations) means FSE have problems with fueling and reading parameters. Similar issues exist in A2A planes, the Aerosoft Twin Otter and I am sure in other "high end addons", but not so severe.

Anyway great to see that they are working on it!

just took the 208 carvan from LFSW. but havent got enough fuel to get where I need to and none at the airport! Whats my next step? not sure how re-fuels work at FSE?

Quote from: robt100;396708just took the 208 carvan from LFSW. but havent got enough fuel to get where I need to and none at the airport! Whats my next step? not sure how re-fuels work at FSE?

I ordered some fuel last night but it can take up to 48 hours to be delivered, I didn't realise we were that low sorry.

NP. im 90nm out with 13kgs left :g: I guess i can land,m refuel and carry on?

BALLS! Changed flight plan to airport with fuel and accidently clicked to relocate back to LFSW :( guess i just have to try again later!

You can absolutely refuel en route.

Strangley, FSE seemed to think I was at the airport I wanted to re-fuel at. So started a flight from there, got my fuel, and hey presto $5800 are mine :D I promise ill leave more fuel in it next time. Whoever left 20% in the tank should feel very bad :P

Just refuel before you set off.  You only ever pay for the fuel you use when renting, so if you fill it to 50% say, but use only 20%, that is all you will pay for.  Just watch your weights :)

Thanks for the tip! My main problem was no fuel at the starting airport.

Regarding the DMW group, how does it work regarding payments etc with flights? Is there certain do's and dont's?

Quote from: robt100;396717Regarding the DMW group, how does it work regarding payments etc with flights? Is there certain do's and dont's?

If you fly an assignment for dMw you will receive 40% of the the profit made from the flight and the group will receive 60%.

If you fly the assignment for yourself obviously you will receive the full amount. We haven't really discussed the 'dos and donts' but it's generally down to common sense.  If you rent an aircraft using the groups money or buy fuel using the groups money then it's only fair that you fly the assignment(s) for the group.  

Don't feel like you have to fly assignments to add to the groups account, you do need to have a comfortable personal bank balance to cover any costs for things like paying a lease for example.  However we also need to keep the groups bank balance healthy to pay for the ordering of fuel and supplies to keep our FBO's running.

So it's a case of just using your head to determine what it is you need at the point of planning an assignment, if that makes sense :)

How do I choose to run it for the group??
As another point of note, ive left the 208 caravan at LFDN. Quite a few 5-10PAX charter flights for anyone that wants them!

Thanks for the info Sparko, I'll get some more funds over to the group (Sent 1k earlier) I Assume fuel is free at our own fuel stops? (well, pre-paid at a lower price)

When you have set your flight up, go to 'my flight' within the client and you can choose to fly it for 'Dead Men Walking', if you have set your assignments to 'your flight'

When you select assignments you can also use the drop down menu on the 'assign flight to' 'Dead Men Walikng' so you can do it 2 ways.

Fuel isn't free, you still have to buy it even if it's from us, but if you buy it using a leased dMw aircraft I think it's free.  The best way to earn money is to get a lease on an aircraft as you can easily rake in 5-7k on one assignment.

Don't concentrate on earning cash for the group in the early stages, get some money behind you, get a plane and then start chipping in to the group account :)

Got a lease on a citation II so have transferred my lease of the Beechcraft 200 to the group, feel free to use but please don't take it too far away from our FBO's :)

Quote from: robt100;396726As another point of note, ive left the 208 caravan at LFDN.

The group planes, at least the ones I hve leased are ment to be stationed on our FBO`s. You can fly elsewhere, but when you leave the plane it should be parked on our FBO. THe next guy might have plans to do some flying on our FBO`s and then have to pick up the plane hours a way from home. Slightly more annoynig than having to refuel I would say.

Count that as a don`t!

OK! No problem, didnt know that one! I'll learn next time. I saw $7k and couldnt say no :blush2:

Right, found a charter from where i left the 208 back to LFCM, so now at LFCM with about 70% fuel. (oh and the job was done for DMW ;) )

Quote from: robt100;396792OK! No problem, didnt know that one! I'll learn next time. I saw $7k and couldnt say no :blush2:

No worries :) you were'nt to know, it's in France so it's not a problem, any fuel used to get it back to our FBO's will be minimal anyway and can be reimbursed from the group account if need be