Dead Men Walking

:rant:
Don't know about his forum spam but he really got on my tits in the radders match tonight. tw in spawn, flashbangs in spawn, firing while SL and Admin were trying to brief,  ignoring the SLs calls to do his own thing and leaving the bomb carrier on his own rather than accompanying him.

Great, so he won a few rounds on his own, if he had played as part of a team rather than a one man band then maybe more of the team would have been alive at the end of each round hence less need to buy more weapons etc etc.

I was so tempted just to kick the little git.  
 :rant:

//Rant mode off.

Well, my chest feels much lighter now.

QuoteOriginally posted by BlueBall@Dec 7 2003, 09:14 PM
:rant:
Don't know about his forum spam but he really got on my tits in the radders match tonight. tw in spawn, flashbangs in spawn, firing while SL and Admin were trying to brief,  ignoring the SLs calls to do his own thing and leaving the bomb carrier on his own rather than accompanying him.

Great, so he won a few rounds on his own, if he had played as part of a team rather than a one man band then maybe more of the team would have been alive at the end of each round hence less need to buy more weapons etc etc.

I was so tempted just to kick the little git.  
 :rant:

//Rant mode off.

Well, my chest feels much lighter now.

Wish you'd kicked him, he was AWPing the ass of us second half. But seriously, yeah he does get a little wound up if he get killed, and as you say it comes over as if he doesn't deserve to like Tox, Red, or several other Twig type players.

QuoteOriginally posted by BlueBall@Dec 7 2003, 10:14 PM
:rant:
Don't know about his forum spam but he really got on my tits in the radders match tonight. tw in spawn, flashbangs in spawn, firing while SL and Admin were trying to brief,  ignoring the SLs calls to do his own thing and leaving the bomb carrier on his own rather than accompanying him.

Great, so he won a few rounds on his own, if he had played as part of a team rather than a one man band then maybe more of the team would have been alive at the end of each round hence less need to buy more weapons etc etc.

I was so tempted just to kick the little git.  
 :rant:

//Rant mode off.

Well, my chest feels much lighter now.

I agree BB some rounds it was 8 on 6 and DA on his own team.

I just wonder isn't DA ghost or am I wrong?

This guy is really getting on my tits. How many times has he got to be told to play like an adult and not a child. costa Del Sol map tonight he knifes me then kills himself and changes sides. i told him that he was being really annoying and he did apologise. however, that does not get round the fact that he cannot control himself and it is just one thing after another.

I don't get to play much these days but when I do I do not expect tarts like him to spoil my enjoyment.

As far as I am concerned his last warning is past.

Was watching DA tonight and generally getting really annoyed with his 'in round' scripts  as I take the personal view that they are the wrong side of the dotted line.  Watching his sniper script for example really bugged me.  I mentioned this to some Admins on server and on the next map BB happened to be watching DA (cs_italy - DA was a T and in the sniper window facing down the long corridor).  BB observed him grenade spamming the corridor with multiple smokes and possibly also with FBs as well - I happened to be the one coming up the long corridor at the time.  

I asked DA if he was grenade spamming ("DA - were you grenade spamming?") and he did not reply.  I asked him again ("Well?") and he did not reply.  Finally I asked him how many smoke grenades he had bought and eventually, just as I was typing my fourth attempt to get an answer he replied "a few".  I asked him to rejoin the server as punishment and kicked him.  He did not return.  BB thinks he may have caught a demo of this.

I may have been harsh, but behaviour like this really sticks in my throat, it is totally against TCS and everything we stand for.  The grenade spamming on its own was sufficient to warrant the kick imo (no ban was applied), but the added bonus for me was that he was also a script user.  I am still contemplating how to approach this subject of scripts as I know this is a bit of a Pandora's box, but it is one that really makes me mad.

TL.

PM sent to him.  I may have forgotten to cc OB in on the PM but I did note the cc in the text at the bottom.  If the Admins feel it appropriate I will apologise to DA for kicking him without due warning as per the Admin Code of Conduct.

TL.

QuoteOriginally posted by TeaLeaf
DA,

It disappoints me that I had to take action against you tonight, but you really should know better.
The fact that I had to ask you three times before gettng an answer to my questions was also disappointing.
The fact that you then did not return to the server was a further disappointment.
All in all, it was disappointing. :(

dMw is not about bending the rules to max your personal score or to obtain the win 'at all costs'. You should know better and we expect better of you in the future.

TL.

cc Oldlboke

I got the demo. I deliberately watched him as he was annoying the hell out of me in dust. he seemed to be able to switch weapons at the drop of a hat.

Anyway, demo shows:

Killing hossies while on HOLD - not TCS and giving bad example on our public server
Some funny scripting - seems to be firing multiple simultaneous shots from pistol (from landing aiming towards apartment route)
A fast weapon switch - scripted? I dunno may be playing with keys or have it bound to a mousewheel but it seems to fire as it switches ;)
How did he know TL was at bottom left of arch to tunnel?
grenade spamming (6 smokes) twice
and finally, for me the worst bit of all, MAKING ABSOLUTELY NO BLOODY EFFORT TO HELP HIS TEAM!

I feel better now.

Demo available here (http://www.sutherlandweb.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dmw/da.dem) but it's 9 Mb so be warned.

QuoteChicken! ;)
I saw you about to post a reply int he DA topic , cam eback and there was none

Rofl ....I stated to type then thought i must have a look at the demo


After looking at the demo .....  If i had seen that wepswitch on a public player they would be intantly kicked

Smoke Spam ...Again i would have kicked...any of these repeated would be a ban...he did it every round

Thsi is the first week of a public server ..thank god we didnt have any of the public to see it  :eyebrow:  

TBH I only looked 2mins of the demo before i got pissed off....Get ya self on a STD config DA :(

DemoPlayer (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/martin.southerden/downloads/SKdemo%20Player-1.1.zip)

BTW you don't need a demo player for CZ - just type "playdemo demoname" in console (press ESC then select disconnect to stop it playing)

And this just in.

Ignore everything but the second word and the last line.  Interesting that he thinks the matter is settled.  I'll watch the demo tomorrow evening and maybe post more.

TL.

QuoteOriginally posted by DarkAngel
yeah sorry m8 on another note 2 unreg people came onto the mh we asked them were they got the pw from they said off some server.

Their steam id's are 0:1:4525447 CheekyChimp and 0:1:4812115 SubSero.

And i didnt come back to the server stright away is because i was summoned for dinner :) . I did return later on a full stomach.

I know there is a grenade spam rule though i really only thought it was appointed just to mainly he's but hey nevermind i know now matter settled.

Dom

If we're really serious about cheating the guy should go.  :angry:  I've not seen a more convincing example of 'wrong doing' ever. I have a weapon switch on my mousewheel, as does BB I believe, but when you switch the weapon is always cocked. What is worrying is that if he can do that and KNOW the rules and ethos of dMw, he is capable of anything.

Yup but my weapon switch is "go_slot 2" :)

I don't get the gun switching problem to be honest. I use Rhizzah's script that allows switching between rifle, pistol,C4 and greandes with single keystrokes. So I too can wildy cycle through guns like DA did in the demo. Apart from that odd muzzel flash and the fact that his wild weapon changes seemed pointless, I can't see the issue?

If the keybind selected and fired the gun with a single keydtroke then that's something else. But I distinctly saw him select a gun while his cursor was right over a team mates head. There was the weird muzzel flash but the other player definately wasn't hit? So it would seem he's just using a quick select script like 'Rhizzah's helper'. That or I've completely missed the point somewhere?

The hostage killing was only happening at the beiginning of the round while everyone was connecting to the server. After the restart he only shot a hossie once and that was a mistake as he aimed for the radio.

The grenande spamming was all wrong though. It's against the rules on any decent server and completely out of order on a TCS one. It's cheating pure and simple.

DA, like a few others, observes TCS because he has too, not because he wants to. The PM was spot on but I don't think his reply should end the matter. Apart from being almost unintelligible it certainly didn't give the impression he thought it was a big deal.

QuoteDA, like a few others, observes TCS because he has too, not because he wants to

Then what's the point of being in dMw. I thought the idea was to get away from ar*eholes like that? He's an admin for Christ's sake! But I suppose it's like modern life, it's never anyone's fault, nobody takes responsibility for themselves or their actions anymore and a grudging 'sorry' makes it all go away. Well it pisses me off!

QuoteOriginally posted by BlueBall@Dec 13 2004, 12:06 AM
Yup but my weapon switch is "go_slot 2" :)

[post=71753]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

As is mine.

After a quick test ..

RZE gives a muzzel flash in demo ....that may be why clever BB has put a winky in his post

Just watched the demo and am now trying to organise my thoughts whilst controlling a 101 temperature :(  Several things struck me and I will try to post something later today when my head feels a little more coherent.

In the mean time, next time you see DA with a shotgun ask yourself this:

Could someone fire the shotgun and then jump with exactly the same timing and regularity for each shot without using a script?  I watched him for extended periods on cs_office last night and I didn;t see a single shotgun shot where he didn't immediately jump.  All shot & jump combinations were identical to my eyes.  Now you can do this manually, but I can't see how the uniformity of the combination can be achieved without a shoot/hop script of some sort.  What are your views?

A final thought:  as I said earlier this is a real Pandora's box so we need to debate this thoroughly if we think we have a problem so that we cover all of the bases and know which ground we stand on before taking any action - if and only if any action is required (and I am not sure yet it is).  For example, quick switching is allowed in CS/CZ but how about a script that fires your AWM/Scout etc and then whips your pistol straight out until you release a key and then it switches straight back to sniper rifle.  There will be variants along this theme that we will deem acceptable and some others that we do not.  Where do you draw the line!

Maybe we shoudl consider this further in the TCS Admins thread rather than just under DA's, but on the other hand the thread is already here so I'll just keep on spouting.....

TL.

QuoteOriginally posted by JonnyAppleSeed@Dec 13 2004, 02:26 AM
After a quick test ..

RZE gives a muzzel flash in demo ....that may be why clever BB has put a winky in his post

[post=71762]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

I am 100% certain that BB does NOT see a muzzle flash. He has the same setup as me, that is:

bind "MWHEELDOWN" "slot1" or go_slot1/2 depening on which version of cs it is
bind "MWHEELUP" "slot2"

All that does is to select either primary or secondary weapon. When the weapon appears in the hand it goes through the cocking animation before it's ready to fire.
If Rizzuh's script does that then imo it's pushing hard at the edges.

EDIT *Typing

QuoteOriginally posted by Doorman@Dec 13 2004, 08:29 AM
I am 100% certain that BB does NOT see a muzzle flash. He has the same setup as me, that is:

bind "MWHEELDOWN" "slot1" or go_slot1/2 depening on which version of cs it is
bind "MWHEELUP" "slot2"

All that does is to select either primary or secondary weapon. When the weapon appears in the hand it goes through the cocking animation before it's ready to fire.
If Rizzuh's script does that then imo it's pushing hard at the edges.

EDIT *Typing

[post=71768]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

:withstupid: I have to go through the whole palaver of raising gun, cocking gun, aiming, missing :(

QuoteOriginally posted by TeaLeaf@Dec 13 2004, 08:03 AM
In the mean time, next time you see DA with a shotgun ask yourself this:

Could someone fire the shotgun and then jump with exactly the same timing and regularity for each shot without using a script?  I watched him for extended periods on cs_office last night and I didn;t see a single shotgun shot where he didn't immediately jump.  All shot & jump combinations were identical to my eyes.  Now you can do this manually, but I can't see how the uniformity of the combination can be achieved without a shoot/hop script of some sort.  What are your views?

[post=71767]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

I wondered about that when he was in sniper window on italy. He was strafing left/right and firing 2 shots but it was just soooooo regular. I know I cannot get anywhere near that level of consistency of key tapping but then again I'm crap ;)

I've been thinking of drafting a piece for a starting point of what we think acceptable regarding scripting. I'll do it this week and post it up here for review prior to us agreeing on format.

hope you feel better soon TL?

Rhizzah doesn't show muzzel flashes for me either. Going to rifle swings the AK-47 down from the upper right but there is no cocking action. It still takes a moment to bring the weapon to bear so it's not instant. Going back to pistol includes cocking the pistol before it can be fired. I really don't think DA was using Rhizzah's scropt, as the weapon changes seemed too quick and there is still that odd muzzel flash to account for.

It's just that I can't see how we can deal with the problem without banning all scripts execpt buy scripts or maybe Rhizzah/nightwish? And policing that will be nigh on impossible.  :( This is especially true now we have a public CZ server.

QuoteOriginally posted by smilodon@Dec 13 2004, 11:29 AM
Rhizzah doesn't show muzzel flashes for me either. Going to rifle swings the AK-47 down from the upper right but there is no cocking action. It still takes a moment to bring the weapon to bear so it's not instant. Going back to pistol includes cocking the pistol before it can be fired. I really don't think DA was using Rhizzah's scropt, as the weapon changes seemed too quick and there is still that odd muzzel flash to account for.

It's just that I can't see how we can deal with the problem without banning all scripts execpt buy scripts or maybe Rhizzah/nightwish? And policing that will be nigh on impossible. :( This is especially true now we have a public CZ server.

[post=71796]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

I'd go further than that and say that it would be impossible for us to unilaterally police which scripts are used.  However we can still have 'standards' to which all members need to adhere.

I use RZE as well but I don't use all of the features (I tend just to use the bulk purchase load out options) and nothing else.  However in my play on the server this morning I could not recreate the muzzle flash that the demo shows  :eyebrow:

TL.

My wep-change ...(std RZE)

bind "KP_HOME" "go_slot1"
bind "KP_LEFTARROW" "go_slot2"
bind "KP_END" "weapon_knife

Will give u muzzel flash on the demo  :D

I too have a quick pistol script just saves hitting button 1 or 2

bind "button5" "slot2"
bind "button5" "slot1"


Right too da the demo...watched it

1.Killing hossies a no  no even if you are waiting for the round to start (doesnt look good to others) as with TK/TW :(

2. nade spamming another no no  :angry:  :(  (He knows the rules)

3. his quick switch does look very diffrent to mine  <_<

4.it did look like he had a strafe/shoot script of some sort (as iam sure 1 or 2 others that play here have

5.i noticed too that when he as a shotty he does jump and shoot at the same time.every time..thought it was just the way he played but there are scripts out there to do this as i've just found out Here (http://www.counter-script.net/) scripts for just about everything

QuoteI suppose it's like modern life, it's never anyone's fault, nobody takes responsibility for themselves or their actions anymore and a grudging 'sorry' makes it all go away. Well it pisses me off!

:withstupid:

All in all it dont look good do we want players like this? how far as someone got to go before we say enough is enough? this is not the 1st time DA as been brought up in the admin section..read the whole thread. again he is not alone there are others that every few months get a post in here :(

I think its time to make a stand do we put up with players that constintly bend/brake the rules? or do we start to get tough?

on a personal note i do like DA when ive spoke to him in RL seems a nice lad..

my2p

Maybe time for a PW change if we gettin unreged peeps on

Maybe the muzzle flash just shows in the demo then and not rendered real time?

TL.

QuoteOriginally posted by squonk@Dec 13 2004, 01:33 PM
Maybe time for a PW change if we gettin unreged peeps on

Twas something that yesterday I put on my 'To Do' list for today.  I'll get on it.

TL.

I'd suggest (and this is probably well under consideration anyway) that there is a reposting/updating of the standards of play and some structured consequences for those who break them, so no one is in any doubt about what the result of their actions will be in the future. Then if it is decided to bin /demote someone, there can be no arguments.

Just my pennies worth

As mentioned I'll get a draft of "scripting standards" up here this week for us to discuss before posting. I hope to get it done by Tue night.

Any further communication with DA?

He was on the server last night with his Scout/Pistol script  <_<

Other than that, nothing. I think we need to make a concerted effort to agree the wording on the scripting stuff and then get it on the forums and maybe a page on the website. We can then start addressing issues. We can't do much until we have a rule published I guess.

How about "Any custom configuration that is not related to buying or optimising your network connection, is considered cheating"?

I find that the game funnily enough plays ok without any config lines other than the two above exceptions.