iRacing - My view

[spudgun55]

totally agree with oldie, i tried iracing for 2 months, did not like it much to begin with, but after a while it started to grow on me, the graphics are very nice but to be honest in the end as i progressed i felt like i wasn,t allowed to race wheel to wheel , the fear of losing hard earned points made me not take any risks, and other drivers with lower points would just let you through. insubcribed and will stick with LFS.

[vobler]

Now with iRacing:
I think that the piece of software they now have is at least on par with LFS, from reviews and videos. I also think it will become better that LFS real quick due to the incredible development power they have.

Thanks for sharing Mille,

I agree, thats why I'm gradually phasing out my LFS driving. Even if they currently are behind LFS in some areas.

I dislike the pricing principle. It is way too expensive to be democratic and only appeals to us rich developped countries, it "forces" the user to buy a lot of extras once hooked, and I do not like "renting" a piece of software.
The monthly fee, subscription, is in my opinion a very dangerous precedent for sim racing..

Of cause I would prefer to pay one time, one fee! Who wouldn't? But I don't buy your reasoning. If you have a computer capable to run iRacing, you are rich enough to pay the price. It has nothing to do with developed countries or not. All sims have this problem.

The price is what it is. Some feel it is expensive and some feel it is dirt cheap.
There is a lot in my life I can't afford. But I don't feel I have to make up excuses for not affording it. I just don't buy it. If I really want it; I sacrifice something to get it. Real racing is way more than I can afford. I'm not sacrificing my home. iRacing is the next best thing.
Thats all.

[Mille Sabords]

My point is not about it being expensive or not.
It is expensive if you do not play a lot (I don't fire LFS a lot) but still affordable for me.
I do not see anything that explains why they need a subscription, rather than fixed price.
I don't like the fact that you have nothing left (rental) when the subscription is over.
I also refuse to purchase a demo...

These 3 pricing issues together make me think that iRacing is targeting a market that is adults that treat themselves with an expensive toy to feel special or hardcore sim racers that will go for the best out there if they can get it without selling their body or parts of it. I feel I am neither so this marketing repulses me instead of attracting me, that's all.

I do not think iRacing is highly expensive but if I subscribed I would not feel happy / proud / part of something like I did by purchasing LFS. I would be one more customer of a large machine... better game, it seems like it, but not a game that makes ME want to support it and fund it with my money.
As long as good races and fun can be found on LFS that's where I will be (on dMr servers for example

[The Moose]

Its a real love/hate thing I've got going with iRacing.   Currently i don't have my own subscription, i just do a friends oval racing for him, and drive the road cars offline.

 Several months since release I'm still not tempted to buy in.  It's still only half a sim, which would be fine if it wasn't for the fact they are charging what they are. I'm not saying it's too expensive (though i certainly don't feel its anything like good value for money) but there are far to many standard features missing at the present time.  This is improving slowly, but after all that time and money on development i would have expected a lot of stuff that is currently missing to have been there from the start.
 

 The Elitism amongst a lot of the iRacing crowd is like nothing I've witnessed before. Just reading some of the stuff on the RSC iRacing forum, and the official forum makes me hate half the drivers before I've even encountered them.:boxing:
 
 Luckily there are a few people with their heads screwed on, but it seems that the majority shoot down the slightest criticism of iRacing. It seems that because of what they are paying for this sim they cant bring themselves to admit it's flaws.  I've been a bit too fanboyish  about nKPro in the past, but i never once claimed it to be something it wasn't.  I always admitted it's (sometimes major) shortcomings.  
 Never have i come across a sim racing community that my initial impression has been "what a complete bunch of tossers" before.  A decent community is an important part of a sim for me.

 The SR thing is a good idea in theory. No one want idiots or wreckers on the track but it does make the racing (the road racing anyway) a bit sterile at times.  You shouldn't be scared to attempt overtaking. You shouldn't be scared about minor contact. (it's not desirable, but it happens in racing) or running wide and getting a couple of wheels off the track. It's just a bit harsh imo.  
 Yes, it's not to difficult to keep your SR high, but you shouldn't even have to think about it when your racing. It's always in the back of your mind though. Everyone here tries to race clean don't they?  iRacing wants to make people race like robots.

 Without private severs and leagues the team element is missing, as is the having fun with your friends/regular racers element.    Sim racing should be a fun thing, as well as a place for serious racing.  iRacing seems a bit stuck up it's own arse at times.   It lacks that social aspect i get with nKPro and LFS.

 The cars are great fun to drive (apart from the solstice, which is tolerable at best) Its a shame the Radical and Mazda had such huge physics flaws, but that appears to be fixed now.  The Radical is a huge amount of fun to drive.
 
 There's nothing else to be said about the tracks. They are simply fantastic.  Nothing else in sim racing comes close to the laser scanned tracks. They are by far the biggest selling point, and the thing that really impresses me with iRacing.   If you took away the laser scanned tracks i think a lot more people would realise that iRacing is presently not much more than an above average sim, but really not as special as people seem to have convinced themselves it is. (i guess when your paying what they are charging, you have to convince yourself that's its the mutts nuts )
 
If you stuck laser scanned tracks in LFS and nKPro i think they would both measure up really well.  I even actually enjoyed rFactor on the laser scanned Eastern Creek track, and i really cant stand that pile of poop excuse for a sim normally.  That track made a huge difference.

 So my conclusion is that iRacing has a lot of potential, the cars feel good and the tracks are very impressive.  It just lacks so much in other areas at the moment that it's not worth the money for me.  The iRacing system does absolutely nothing for me either.  I treat doing my friends oval races just as fun (though obviously i race seriously,it's his name and reputation on the line) I take no notice of the rankings whatsoever and just get out and enjoy the races.

 I might actually buy into it eventually just for the oval racing, as that's an experience i cant get anywhere else.  For all my road racing needs i'm happy to stick with LFS and nKPro for the time being. I'll always feel I'm missing out on track quality with those two sims, but i gain so much more in the social and fun aspects.

The marketing and "real racers endorsements" seem to have worked fantastically though :narnar:  
 "OMG!  Dale Earnhardt Jr. races it, it has to be the best thing evahhh"   [/sarcasm]


How was that for a ramble?
 If you've just read all that **** you need to get out more.

[delankster]

How was that for a ramble?

4/5 :thumbsup2:

[Doorman]

Great post! You've hit the nail on the head as far as I'm concerned. 5/5

[vobler]

My point is not about it being expensive or not.
It is expensive if you do not play a lot (I don't fire LFS a lot) but still affordable for me.
I do not see anything that explains why they need a subscription, rather than fixed price.
I don't like the fact that you have nothing left (rental) when the subscription is over.
I also refuse to purchase a demo...

These 3 pricing issues together make me think that iRacing is targeting a market that is adults that treat themselves with an expensive toy to feel special or hardcore sim racers that will go for the best out there if they can get it without selling their body or parts of it. I feel I am neither so this marketing repulses me instead of attracting me, that's all.

Yes and everything you are telling us is that you don't like it. You say nothing about the sim itself. Its all about you. You dont that, you dont this. I bet you have an internet subscription. I bet you have a phone. I bet you have some form of tv subcription. I could go on. Do you own those? No, but You want to own your sims. You own your PC you own your wheel like you own your phone and your tv. Is that not enough? And if you get an LFS server at some ISP do you think you own it?

As I have stated before, I don't care if people don't like iRacing.
There is one thing you need to understand. That is that the feeling when driving in iRacing makes me and many with me, care less how it's sold or marketed. Its just awesome.

But I buy the points of Oldie Doorz and Spudgun. They have tried it. They feel it is at loss in some places. And it is. But the main thing is there. The drive. The feel for driving a real car. Moose says that if you put the tracks in LFS or NKP it will be the same or better. I agree. Its been months since I stated that on these forums. But its not going to happen soon.
In september Scawen stated that we would not get a patch soon, because the standards are higher now. He knows it. Stefano knows it.

Our best bet in the not to distant future is to sign up for iRacing and support them, let them have the userbase they need to give us what we want.

[The Moose]

Our best bet in the not to distant future is to sign up for iRacing and support them, let them have the userbase they need to give us what we want.

 Sorry, cant agree with that one.
 They are the ones with the bottomless moneypit.   Give people what they want and they will naturally attract the bigger userbase.
 
 There's no other situation in life that i can think of where you would start handing out cash for something in the hope that they will turn the product into something you want further down the line.  

If and when they supply the product I'm interested in and I'll get my credit card out without hesitation.

 It's a good sim. It's up to iRacing to decide if they want to attract a bigger userbase.   I hope so, it deserves to  improve,grow  and succeed.

[Romus]

There's no other situation in life that i can think of where you would start handing out cash for something in the hope that they will turn the product into something you want further down the line.  

With that attitude there would be no global financial crisis

I feel that iRacing has managed to build up enthusiasm among many simracing lovers. I don't say hardcore simracers or any other category, just among some. Many are appealed to what it gives and for many the price is paid from the bottom of the pocket moneys.

I have not told about my feelings toward the sim in ages, so let's say something about it, to stay in topic. I've paid one years subscription, but have not raced for more than a month. I took one year right away, because I thought the sim would evolve a lot during that time and I wanted to be able to follow the developement. At first I was amazed of the quality of the tracks and the depth of the sim. Then I started missing good social fun at dMr.

I'm not very competition oriented. I rather compete against myself, try to improve my lines and car balance control, and whatever is needed to drive fast and be consistent. I get most pleasure of beating my times and rising my level. Thursday races are then more serious battles for me, but in general, during the week, I just try to improve.

iRacing with stranges felt like nothing but competition. I got often pushed off the track by a bloke slower than me. There was no social aspect at all. I'll try again for sure, I'm happy I can do it when I want due to the one year subscription, but currently it's more for offline hotlapping nights with friends. All my friends who have tried both iRacing and LFS prefer iRacing. (none of these are regular simracers)

LFS with dMr however, meets well with my interests towards simracing. Sim is good enough to differentiate aliens from folks like me, but allows me to feel when I've improved and learned something. Pleasure from working hard and finally improving my times is what keeps me with simracing. Racing with dMr gives me people around me whose driving is not completely unpredictable, my experience will not be ruined by fellow racers. Also gettings setups and ideas and just talking BS is an important part of the whole experience.

[The Moose]

There's no other situation in life that i can think of where you would start handing out cash for something in the hope that they will turn the product into something you want further down the line.  

 Actually, I worded that pretty poorly.    But you get the gist of what I mean I'm sure.  

 I'm not going to invest $156+ extras a year on what iRacing might become.  (yes, I'm tight )  Especially not when they have the financial backing that they do.

[vobler]

Sorry, cant agree with that one.
 They are the ones with the bottomless moneypit.  

I was speaking of users not money. They need users to tell them what they (users) want.

[The Moose]

I was speaking of users not money. They need users to tell them what they (users) want.

Ahh, fair enough, I slightly misunderstood what you were saying.  

[vobler]

There's no other situation in life that i can think of where you would start handing out cash for something in the hope that they will turn the product into something you want further down the line.  
.

Maybe in no other situation. But regarding sims I did it both with NKP and LFS. They both have failed to come up with that product i wanted.

I think its fair to give iRacing two years like I gave the two others.

[The Moose]

Maybe in no other situation. But regarding sims I did it both with NKP and LFS. They both have failed to come up with that product i wanted.

I think its fair to give iRacing two years like I gave the two others.

The difference being that cost you a total of what? $100 for years of entertainment. (ok, not everyone felt they got good value with nKPro, but it was the best £25 i ever spent

 2 years of iRacing is a big investment, relatively speaking.

 The '79 F1 car and the lovely looking GT car might just swing it for me though.  I don't know if i can resist once they are out.

[vobler]

2 years of iRacing is a big investment, relatively speaking.

You can buy much very cheap. You don't always get what you wanted. If this is the price I have to pay; so be it.

Most of you have the computer you have *beacause* you are sim racing. You add hundreds of pounds worth of goodes to your PC's so you can race. Not wanting to spend 100 pound a year on a good sim does not make sense to me.