Build Log - Corsair Obsidian 900D

[DannagE]

I noticed they rolled out an update as well. I'm still at Good for all my drives but the C drive is at 27TB Written, the highest of them all in tems of use. Any idea what your total written data was before you replaced the drive?

27TB is about the size of the last CoD patch. I'm sure you'll be fine for a while

[TeaLeaf]

27TB is about the size of the last CoD patch. I'm sure you'll be fine for a while

Now *that* was funny! :roflmao:
I had a good old chortle

[albert]

And I thought MSFS2020 was extreme. Is that 27 tiddly biddlies?

[TeaLeaf]

The Obsidian 900 build  has hit the seven (and a half) year upgrade itch.

The case, pump and radiators will all be retained, but a new CPU, mobo and RAM have been ordered, along with some fresh fluids and a new CPU block as I am moving from Team Blue to Team Red.

I've been very impressed with the Mayhems X1 coolant I put into the system in 2013.  It's lasted almost eight years and has not clouded, grown algae or spawned new life forms.  Temps still seem to be the same as originally too, although when I break the old system down to install the new parts I will be doing a cleaning cycle on the radiators etc.

Still looking for that elusive graphics card though.  Decided I want a 3080 and am waiting (hopefully and probably stupidly) for the Gigabyte AORUS GeForce RTXâ,,¢ 3080 XTREME WATERFORCE WB 10G.  It comes with a 4 year guarantee and the waterblock (covering the GPU, RAM and VRMs) and backplate already installed.  

[ATTACH=CONFIG]5753[/ATTACH]

Looking forward to being able to join you folks in some 'modern' games again.   I just need to find that new graphics card............ and perhaps a nice new monitor too - my 30" Dell 3007WFP-HC is about 14 years old now and is showing it's age with a leisurely 60Hz refresh rate and a glacial 8ms response time (grey to grey)!

[albert]

Nice reading for sure, glad you've made the move to continue the legacy of this rig and bring it up to 2021 spec.

I can comment on Gigabyte Waterforce cards having owned 2 in the past. I worked with the Obsidian 350D for 7 years and it did a great job well above my expectations. Where the 1080 and the 3080 cards have differred is in their ability to generate heat inside the box. Even with some very good fans the 3080 is producing a lot of very hot air continually.

I have 48cms of space height wise to play with, not much more than the 350D so to get past the heat issue a Fractal Define 7 (mid tower) replaced my 360D a few weeks ago. Gone are the internal heat spikes and the new box hardly sounds like it's powered up until the graphics card really starts to work hard. It's 3 cm wider, 5cm deeper and 2.5cm taller than the 350D but where it is so much better is in the internal design and flexibility. The Obsidian cases were ahead of their time, the Fractal is like another leap forward.

Onto the Waterforce. My biggest problem has been fan quality closely follwed by pump noise and efficiency. Comparing the Gigabyte cooling system to MSI or Corsair, the latter win hands down up to the 1080Ti or H150i products I have used. Having a small case made it more noticable which components were struggling. So perhaps do plenty reading up on the card and it's quality issues. Since you probably won't get hold of one quickly, there may be writeups to check out. I replaced the pump once under warranty, it took 4 months pre-Covid. It took 3 months to convince them to accept the RMA. I don't imagine any other card makers are much better, but 7 months of trouble for a £1200 card was just not worth it.

I went for an air cooled 3080 from MSI this time around, mainly because it was 30% cheaper than watercooled, available, and my case now can handle the air cooling whereas the 350D wouldn't stand a chance. If your 900D is as narrow as my 350D, I suggest you look at cases as well, I assure you if you do the quality and modularity of new designs will make your new rig so much more enjoyable. I am still getting used to the Ilyama monitor we have been discussing on the forums, but for the price, I find no faults. 4K is still a myth with the 3080, yes 60FPS is possible, but after 144Hz, even with the higher pixel density, it still feels sluggish and the VA panel is looking great, so the uplift to 4K feels smaller.

Looking forward to reading through the final spec.

[TeaLeaf]

Nice reading for sure, glad you've made the move to continue the legacy of this rig and bring it up to 2021 spec.

Onto the Waterforce. My biggest problem has been fan quality closely follwed by pump noise and efficiency. Comparing the Gigabyte cooling system to MSI or Corsair, the latter win hands down up to the 1080Ti or H150i products I have used. Having a small case made it more noticable which components were struggling. So perhaps do plenty reading up on the card and it's quality issues. Since you probably won't get hold of one quickly, there may be writeups to check out. I replaced the pump once under warranty, it took 4 months pre-Covid. It took 3 months to convince them to accept the RMA. I don't imagine any other card makers are much better, but 7 months of trouble for a £1200 card was just not worth it.

I went for an air cooled 3080 from MSI this time around, mainly because it was 30% cheaper than watercooled, available, and my case now can handle the air cooling whereas the 350D wouldn't stand a chance. If your 900D is as narrow as my 350D, I suggest you look at cases as well, I assure you if you do the quality and modularity of new designs will make your new rig so much more enjoyable. I am still getting used to the Ilyama monitor we have been discussing on the forums, but for the price, I find no faults. 4K is still a myth with the 3080, yes 60FPS is possible, but after 144Hz, even with the higher pixel density, it still feels sluggish and the VA panel is looking great, so the uplift to 4K feels smaller.

Looking forward to reading through the final spec.

The extra space and better design really helps, but in the Obsidian 900D Super Tower I have more space than I think I could ever need - and much as the upgrade itch has made me look at a new case as well, I just couldn't justify the cost of doing a 'complete' new build when the 900 already does such a great job (although it fails spectacularly at being suitable for transport to LANs).  For reference:

The 900 case is 69.2cm x 25.2cm x 65cm.
The 350 case is 45cm x 21cm x 44cm.
The Fractal is 54.7cm x 24cm x 47.5cm.

Spec wise I had wanted a 5600X as the sweet spot, but ended up getting 5800X as the 5600X was out of stock and the cost difference was only about £40 when I ordered.  So a slight upgrade on the target CPU but not an essential one for gaming.

Motherboard was going to be another ASUS, but the one I wanted was out of stock so I went with a Gigabyte X570 Aorus Ultra.   Mobo prices are scary high these days and I just can't figure out why people are buying top end boards at the £500+ level unless they want to do some serious LN2 overclocking.   The Gigabyte (despite the 'Ultra' in the name) is just a decent spec, excellent connectivity, solid construction, good power phase delivery and the price still began with a £2xx, so it was a decent alternative to the  Asus X570-E Gaming that I had originally intended.

RAM was another compromise, but with AMD 3600 seems to be the sweet spot, so 32GB (2x16GB) of Ryzen-tuned Corsair is going into the system.   I did think about taking advantage of the 4x8GB performance boost, but the price/choice restrictions for going that route just didn't seem worth it to me, so I stuck with 2x16GB.

Re the graphics card - I'm not overly worried by fans or pump noise as the graphics card I mentioned has none!  It's not an AIO solution, it's just the card with a waterblock stuck onto it which gets connected to my existing custom loop.  The pump, reservoir, radiators and all the fans are all in and from my original build, although I am toying with pre-emptive pump replacement given how long it has been the beating heart of my system.  There's a similar ASUS pre-installed waterblock solution 'available', but the Gigabyte has better clocks - which one I get will probably come down to which one is in stock first.  I could go buy an air-cooled 3080 and then add a waterblock, but when the cards are so darned expensive there's a lot to be said for not voiding your warranty by adding your own waterblock!  All of this is irrelvant though when nothing is available to purchase, which is a real ball ache. :sad:

One of those hindsight things I am happiest with is my decision to use dry connect fittings when the system was built in 2013.  It should make the drain down, cleaning and refill one heck of a sight easier. :thumbsup:

[Chaosphere]

Just to chip in with a slight note, most AIBs do not void your warranty for removing coolers and fitting waterblocks, so that could still be a good option if you end up only finding an air-cooled card. Even the ones that put 'warranty void if removed' stickers on the screws have still repeatedly honoured warranty claims when it is clear the fault is unrelated to the disassembly.

Seems you have the rest all sorted, enjoy!

[TeaLeaf]

Firstly, I meant AIO not AIB.  Original post edited.

My warranty experience is slightly different Chaos.   You void the warranty of almost every manufacturer out there when your remove their cooling solution.   When I looked at T&C's last year EVGA was the only big manufacturer I could find that openly said 'we will honour your warranty of you remove our cooling and put on a custom waterblock' and they seem to have since updated their terms to align with other manufacturers as I can no longer find that statement on their website.  That having been said, there have been many users who when faced with a card failure, have removed their waterblock and put back on the original cooling and then successfully RMA'd the card to get a replacement - this is not the same as it being allowed though!   Reading around there also seems to be a healthy supply of people whose RMA has failed 'because they voided their warranty', so whilst you might get away with it, it does not seem to be something that is guaranteed.   When a card costs £250 I'm less worried by the potential to have an RMA refused, but with modern cards costing close to £1,000 or more then I'm much more hesitant!  If you know of a graphics card manufacturer whose warranty formally allows you to remove the cooling solution and then add your own waterblock without voiding the warranty then I'm all ears as I could not find any last time I looked.  It would at least allow me more choice when trying to find something to buy!

[Chaosphere]

https://www.asus.com/us/support/Article/925/

As you said EVGA, and also MSI, have said the same. Not sure about Gigabyte, I cant remember, but thats already 3 of the big players who will honour warranties even with swapped coolers... unless of course the fault results from that.

And FWIW I was aware you meant AIO in your post, context is king. My reply was only aimed at your mention of air cooled cards... idk why one would buy an AIO equipped GPU and then change the cooler, although with the current climate perhaps that could end up being the only available option!

I'm sure when I first wrote my reply I initially typed AIO and changed it to AIB though...The 2 terms are annoyingly close :roflmao:

Edit -

https://www.evga.com/support/faq/FAQdetails.aspx?f=58128

MSI don't say, which makes it case by case and certainly a gamble. Many have had no issue, I'm sure others have been refused too.

Gigabyte clearly state they will refuse.. but again you can easily find people who have had no issue. YMMV.

Seems Asus and EVGA are the choices if you need an air cooled card to put under water later.

[Gorion]

Tea, the 3080ti with 20GB ram has been leaked.  Might be worth waiting a while

[TeaLeaf]

Thanks G, I have been watching that, but if supply of that is anything like the 3080 I might still be waiting for one in 2022!

https://www.asus.com/us/support/Article/925/

As you said EVGA, and also MSI, have said the same. Not sure about Gigabyte, I cant remember, but thats already 3 of the big players who will honour warranties even with swapped coolers... unless of course the fault results from that.

And FWIW I was aware you meant AIO in your post, context is king. My reply was only aimed at your mention of air cooled cards... idk why one would buy an AIO equipped GPU and then change the cooler, although with the current climate perhaps that could end up being the only available option!

I'm sure when I first wrote my reply I initially typed AIO and changed it to AIB though...The 2 terms are annoyingly close :roflmao:

Edit -

https://www.evga.com/support/faq/FAQdetails.aspx?f=58128

MSI don't say, which makes it case by case and certainly a gamble. Many have had no issue, I'm sure others have been refused too.

Gigabyte clearly state they will refuse.. but again you can easily find people who have had no issue. YMMV.

Seems Asus and EVGA are the choices if you need an air cooled card to put under water later.

The ASUS link you gave is for the USA so is not effective here.  

The ASUS EMEA warranty in the UK has NOT had that change and still voids your warranty if "the product has been tampered, repaired and/or modified by non-authorized personnel", so removing your cooling and putting on a waterblock still voids the ASUS warranty.
The MSI UK warranty has a similar term "Any addition, alteration, installation, modification, removal, or repair of the product, product parts, or product software by any non-MSI authorized third parties;" which means you void your warranty by removing the cooling.
The above type of wording is pretty standard to all of the major graphics cards sold here in the UK.
EVGA's warranty used to explicitly confirm coverage for a waterblock, but is now less specific and more open to interpretation. but is still worse than it was.  You can read the wording here.


So I stand by what I said.  There is a difference between explicitly covering it in the warranty and being able to get away with it by hoping that they don't notice you have removed the cooling, put on a waterblock, then removed the waterblock and replaced the OEM cooling.  When it is a cheaper card you're not so worried.  When the card is costing £1,000+ then you (and I suspect they) will become a little more adherent to the rules and regulations.  Would I try to RMA a card I had a waterblock on by replacing the OEM cooling? Yes of course I would.    Could I rely on it being successful?   No.     At £1,000+ I'm not interested in those who chanced their arm and got away with it, I am looking for a trouble-free warranty, hence now looking at pre-installed waterblocks cards with a nice big four year warranty.

I am happy (and want) to be corrected here.  It would be a much better place if the manufacturers let you remove their cooling and add your own custom waterblock.   Unfortunately from what I read, they don't. :sad:

[Chaosphere]

No, sadly it seems you are quite right. What a total load of **** to have one warranty for a card over there, and another for over here. And what a shame to see companies moving in the wrong direction. Eventually we will just be renting GPUs from them.. with restrictive stuff like this we barely own our products at all any more. Total nonsense.

At £1,000+ I'm not interested in those who chanced their arm and got away with it, I am looking for a trouble-free warranty, hence now looking at pre-installed waterblocks cards with a nice big four year warranty.

Guess this is the only way.

Or...

Hear me out...

- Buy whatever card you can get your mits on. Don't open it.
- Email the company. Clarify if they will support a re-paste and water block application with warranty intact, assuming the damage isn't caused by the process.
- If not, return the card... or sell for a tidy profit. :roflmao:

I mean, this way you either get written proof of warranty, or you just go back to waiting for a card that comes with a block attached.

Personally I will still just buy whatever card, and slap a block on it. When this eventually bites me in the backside, and I come back here and share my warranty experience... I look forward to eating my words and sending a pile of angry salty emails to Asus/EVGA. :doh:

Tech companies suck.

[albert]

When the card is costing £1,000+ then you (and I suspect they) will become a little more adherent to the rules and regulations........  hence now looking at pre-installed waterblocks cards with a nice big four year warranty. :sad:

As I mentioned before £1200 for a pre-installed watercooled card and the Gigabyte fans and pump were not the best. Still they did honour the warranty in Europe. I expect a 3080 with a watercooling solution will be in the region of £1500. That's why I opted for air cooled, from a reputable official supplier. No way I would pick up anything that price from a dodgy eBay hawk. I recommend the MSI https://www.msi.com/Graphics-Card/GeForce-RTX-3080-SUPRIM-X-10G/Overview any day. At 1980Mhz boost and running at 65 degree C aircooled in a mid-tower at 100% utilisation with everyinthing Ultra on Cyberpunk, 75+ FPS. £900 (â,¬1030). You even get the little resting pole with it, saving another £15 lol.

[TeaLeaf]

As I mentioned before £1200 for a pre-installed watercooled card and the Gigabyte fans and pump were not the best. Still they did honour the warranty in Europe. I expect a 3080 with a watercooling solution will be in the region of £1500. That's why I opted for air cooled, from a reputable official supplier. No way I would pick up anything that price from a dodgy eBay hawk. I recommend the MSI https://www.msi.com/Graphics-Card/GeForce-RTX-3080-SUPRIM-X-10G/Overview any day. At 1980Mhz boost and running at 65 degree C aircooled in a mid-tower at 100% utilisation with everyinthing Ultra on Cyberpunk, 75+ FPS. £900 (â,¬1030). You even get the little resting pole with it, saving another £15 lol.

I'm still confused as to whether or not we are talking at cross purposes here Albert.   When you say 'pre-installed watercooled card and the Gigabyte fans and pump' are you talking the AIO solution?  If so I agree and I would not be buying that.

I appreciate the recommendation for MSI, but sadly with everything out of stock everywhere, it's a moot point.   I'd still prefer the pre-installed option, so I'm going to wait and see if any stock of anything arrives any time soon.  At the moment all the retailers see to be clearing back orders or simply have no stock.

[albert]

https://www.gigabyte.com/Graphics-Card/GV-N108TAORUSX-W-11GD-rev-10-11#kf - Is an AIO solution I bought a few years ago but the pump and fan both failed after 1 year for me and to be honest, both were terrible quality., noisy, poor airflow etc. Just feedback take it or leave it.

In terms of availability, of course it's a fact that there is simply not much around to even buy, but I am not selling you it, just recommending a part. Again take it or leave it, all I can say is that it has been a solid product so far.