Concerning legendary items

[Vargen]

It has come to my attention that some feel that there should be a considerable cost for legendary items DKP wise, and some even feel all the mats should be covered by the one getting the item. Even worse I find the fact that seemingly some have to say the least not been verry cooporative or sportsmanlike over Secohan getting his legendary hammer. This I find dissapointing.
 
However, putting this matter behind me, I have come across a pretty nice system taht past redemtion use for legendary items that I would like to adopt, with some modifications however. I wouldn't mind terrably having a DKP cost for Legendary items, but lets not rush it just yet. Blizzard have announced they will add more legendary content and they seem to lean towards tokens and quest items in the future rather then the huge mat costs for the current ones. The thing I liked is how they limit legendary items, one per person. I vision us having something like a vote system for who of the top DKP lifetime earned out of the ones that want and can use the item. But I would really like to get some other views on the matter.
 

Legendary items are bid for using Total DKP earned. The bidding process is otherwise identical to that of other items.
Once a member has successfully bid on a Legendary item, they receive an imaginary 300 DKP deduction from their total DKP. This does not affect current DKP in any way. It is simply a mechanism used to ensure that the same few people do not receive all the Legendary items that may drop for the guild.
Those in the process of collecting items to make a Legendary item may not outbid other guild members on items for the same slot.
Unlike other items, DKP is deducted from players receiving Legendary items once the item is made, not when it was purchased

Taken from the PR site:
http://www.past-redemption.co.uk/dkp.html

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[KreuZ]

Sounds ok to me.

[TeaLeaf]

Q: How does an imaginary DKP deduction have an actual impact on DKP without having any effect on DKP?  

As an aside, I hope that the uncooperative/unsportsmanlike comments above were not aimed at me.  I ended up being in Scholo for 5 and a half hours last night, helping a pallie (repeatedly) trying to do his epic quest.  To have people then asking four and a half hours into the run and in the middle of the pallie quest 'where are you' and 'we're waiting for you at the anvil' was a bit much as nobody at bothered to tell me beforehand what was going on and at no point had I been advised that the making of the hammer was now an emergency and needed to be done immediately.  Hence I was more than a little reluctant to relog and delay the group yet again.  I'm pleased that the hammer was made, I'm delighted for Seco, but please don't shove any comments like that in my face as I really don't think they are deserved given the total lack of communication with me at the time.  I don't have ESP and as I'm not sure where the skill drops I am not planning on spending any DKP on it any time soon.

TL.

[Padding]

Even worse I find the fact that seemingly some have to say the least not been verry cooporative or sportsmanlike over Secohan getting his legendary hammer. This I find dissapointing.

It would interesting to hear who you are taling about here, since i hope its not me either. I was actually the one putting the run together for Secohan last night. After being there 1 time and not getting the mace crafted due to lacking of materials, i thought it could wait until today since i didnt think we had enough stuff but anyways we went back and crafted the mace.

I wouldnt blame TL since nobody asked if we could logoff and get the Essence of fire. That was a mistake from the group making the run there, and therefore also somewhat of my responsobility
 
Now, on a side note my opinion about the mace is that it should have a DKP cost. The items in itself should have a DKP cost, and the materials should have a cost. This is a legendary item, making it the hardest weapon to come by in the game. Some want the legendary weapon, and ofcoz that should cost them something which is not cheap.
 
What the cost should be, i'll leave to other to figure out. Somebody mentioned a total cost of around 350dkp, and that might not be totally off

[KreuZ]

350 DKP when other MC 2handers cost about 120 DKP? :blink:

Doesn't really sound that fair to me.

And about that comment Vargen made, nobody knows who it was meant for, so that doesn't mean he's saying that to your face TL, just leave it as a comment and nothing else.

[Bastet]

350 dkp for a VERY rare drop and one of the best 2h weapons for paladin sounds fairly okee. As for this system of appointing, i dont think i really like it, id rather have us appoint it. Since using this system ppl like opti are sure to try and get it. Making it likely that it will go to some1 that will not have the proper other gear / spec / intention of use.

[Padding]

I picked this up from the Past Redemption site:
 
Eye of Sulfuras 80
Aurastone Hammer 35
Malistar's Defender 20
Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker 80

 
This gives an indication that the legendary item is around 2-3 times the value at the guild of Past Redemption, which many seems to like
 
Thats not counting the materials, which costs a shitload, if they should be bought. So yes, i think the weapon should cost DKP and yes it should not be cheap

[TeaLeaf]

I have to say that a Legendary should cost more than anything we buy elsewhere - my new staff last night cost 260 DKP, so I think this just goes to confirm that a DKP of cost in the order of 350 for a Legendary weapon is about right.

TL.

[KreuZ]

I think it's ok to put a cost on it and I think it's ok to price it abit higher then the other items, but 350 is WAY too much compared to other gear. It may be a legendary but there's still other items that are actually better. And please don't compare the item with BWL items.

Btw Padding, if Aurastone Hammer costs 35 and Malistar's 20 then they're 2handers probably cost about 60, which would mean that the Legendary is barely priced higher then the rest.

[TeaLeaf]

And please don't compare the item with BWL items.

Ok, I have to admit to sailing in uncharted waters here.  I know little about the finer detail fo the game and am happy to admit that most of you Field Marshalls know way more about the technicalities of the game than me, but I honestly do not understand why a legendary item should not be compared in cost to those from BWL?  I'll go to do some thotbotting and maybe it will make it clear to me - I do not know the stats on other available items, but my incomplete understanding says that surely a legendary item is better than an epic one?  Clearly this is the bit you can now put me right, but I thought I would post my confusion anyway as you guys can probably post the explanation quicker than I can thotbot it

TL.

[Bastet]

considering a BWL item does about 80 dmg and 10 dps over a MC item (or a bit more) and the legendary does 80 dmg and 10 dps over a BWL item, and the items cost arround 80-90 dkp for MC and 200-220 for BWL, why shouldnt it cost 300-350?

[KreuZ]

Well according to almost all the post that I've seen by Paladins/Warriors on WoW forums and various guild forums the weapon isn't that good even if the DPS is that high, most would pick any item available in BWL rather than that hammer, Secohan was saying himself that he wasn't even sure if the weapon actually was better then his Herald of Woe that he already had.

I might be wrong I guess but that's the impression I got.

[Vargen]

In short, taking a Warrior as an example, Sulfuras is just barely better then Askandi DPS wise.
We shouldn't overdo the DKP cost either.

[TeaLeaf]

In short, taking a Warrior as an example, Sulfuras is just barely better then Askandi DPS wise.
We shouldn't overdo the DKP cost either.

But what about for a pallie?  And DPS is not the only stats....

TL.

[Bastet]

Well seco said hed happyly pay 500 dkp for it, so i quess it is a better weapon :tongue: