dMw Juniors are loud

[TwoBad]

As the wee ones can get a bit vocal sometime, specially when they're all in the same squad as they were the other day, how about giving them their own channel in TS?  That way if they do start getting a little over excited we can ask them to change.
(btw, my two like the idea)

[Sn00ks]

Seconded!

[Blunt]

good idea, although they do make me chuckle on occasions

[GhostMjr]

good idea, although they do make me chuckle on occasions

Personally doing this has its positives and negatives for us but i think we are missing a trick and the bigger picture.

I.e. i don't want them becoming detached from us as a community.

They know me and a couple of other members on first name turns and us regular players enjoy their company.

In all honesty we don't have alot of younger members and we need some newer members with young ideas.

As my old university professor use to say to our class "you guys teach me more than i read from books".

At the end of the day i've been here since 17 i am now old and grey but we haven't had a regular influx of younger members.

Its up to us as a community to decide how we want to grow and if we encourage them to get there friends on too we could have a nice group of potential dmw LAN members when they are old enough.

I am unsure about the dmw tag though and think this needs to be considered by the community leaders.

Although is their an age limit on the tag or is it open to all?

I know the LAN has an age limit.

[ArithonUK]

I think it is good that you welcome rather than "tolerate" or actively ban younger players. I like playing games like TF2, L4D2 and BFBC2 with my sons, but so many servers are full of foul-mouthed, childish and badly behaved "adults" its difficult to find a place that's there for actual fun.
With other people on Teamspeak with the youngsters, is I think it's preferable, as they can monitor the chat and make sure nobody is saying anything they shouldn't to the kids or each other.

Just my two penneth.

[TwoBad]

Don't get me wrong guys, i'm by no means saying we should banish them to their own channel never to be heard from again.  What i am saying is, on the occasions when they are all on AND their are a good few of us on and they start to get a bit loud, they will have somewhere they can go and continue doing what they do best, being kids.
I have heard them from the other room a couple of time and it has also been mentioned to me by a couple of dMw regulars they the got a bit loud (it was not said with any bad feelings).

I think it is good that you welcome rather than  "tolerate" or actively ban younger players. I like playing games like  TF2, L4D2 and BFBC2 with my sons, but so many servers are full of  foul-mouthed, childish and badly behaved "adults" its difficult to find a  place that's there for actual fun.
With other people on Teamspeak with the youngsters, is I think it's  preferable, as they can monitor the chat and make sure nobody is saying  anything they shouldn't to the kids or each other.

Agreed, but i don't think anyone who is dMw would ever say anything bad to them.  If i did they wouldn't be on TS.  I'm more worried about the chat window.  A month or so ago Poison and I were on with a couple of publics and one started to really mouth off.

Its up to us as a community to decide how we want to grow and if we  encourage them to get there friends on too we could have a nice group of  potential dmw LAN members when they are old enough.

I'm very happy that i found this community last year and have been made such a welcome member.  It's great that the powers that be have given the opportunity for the Juniors, after all this is an adult community when all is said and done.  But i do hope the Junior element is encouraged and i know that my two, given the chance, will be here for a very long time!

I am unsure about the dmw tag though and think this needs to be considered by the community leaders.
Although is their an age limit on the tag or is it open to all?

This was agreed and approved by Ninja.  Personally i think its a good idea as it clearly identifies them as members to both us and publics.

I know the LAN has an age limit.

Please tell my wife!

[Blunt]

, how about giving them their own channel in TS?  That way if they do start getting a little over excited we can ask them to change.
(btw, my two like the idea)

I was assuming that this would be an option not compulsory.
Personally, if they do start getting on my nerves I would tell em.
Haven't had to yet as Dad steps in to quieten it down.
I don't have a problem with them, but I can see that some would.
As GM and Ari said above, It's a good way to learn how to behave on a server, and it's a safe environment where we all look out for them.

[Penfold]

I think we need to tread a fine line here.

Yes, we're an open and friendly community but we also expect certain  standards from our members. It really doesn't matter if you're 10 or  60. Either you fall in line with us, our gaming standards and our  gaming ethos or you don't. If someone's child plays on the server and,  say, goes off fraghunting etc then they should (rightly) be pulled up  on it. At the end of the day yes it's *everyone's* server but we're not a crèche. It's majority rule and sorry, but if your child needs to be told to pipe down then they should be told. At 7, my children are too young for the server but as and when they come online if they're stepping out of line then I wouldn't have a problem with them being told. We can pretty much tell 100% that another member would do it nicely and politely. I have no problem with that.

We keep banging on about standards because that's the very foundation of dMw and why long-term members stay.

Personally, I am reticent about giving them their own channel because  they shouldn't *need* their own channel. Some childish enthusiasm is one  thing but if it becomes irritating to others in that channel then  really they need to be told in the same way that we'd tell anyone else.

We've always welcomed people or all ages and we've never imposed any age  restrictions on the server. Most of the time it's worked well and the  few occasions over the years when it hasn't we've made it clear.

Yes your children are welcome to come and play here - it's *your* community as much as anyone else's but they have to have the maturity, respect and consideration that goes with it.

The LAN does have an age restriction and it's for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the hotel has an 18+ room booking policy, secondly we'd be in loco parentis for any guests under 18 and we don't want the associated hassle that brings under the Children Act 1990. Finally, and the one which swung it for us is that some of the activities that go down at the LAN are most assuredly for over 18's (that's got you wondering hasn't it :norty:). Yes, if you're a parent bringing along a child it's legally it's different but we can't make that distinction.

With regards to tags and the like it's really down to the GL to decide and it's something we/they can discuss. We'll report back on that. However The tag is *not* an identifier as to who may or may not be a member of  dMw. That's not its purpose and never has been.

As always, feel free to respond, rebuke and revile

[lionheart]

Nice post Pen.

[RizZy]

I've got no problem with having the kids on TS with us, they make no more noise & talk just about the same amount of nonsense as the rest of us, & the only thing I've noticed that changes is the language that's used by the rest of us when the jnr's are on, saving the more adult waffle for when there not on.

[Liberator]

It's disturbing to find me not being dark and disturbing on TS, but that's what happens to me when the younger members are on.






I cut myself instead.

[Gone_Away]

It's disturbing to find me not being dark and disturbing on TS, but that's what happens to me when the younger members are on.

I cut myself instead.

Lib.. Seek Help.. immediately...

[Gone_Away]

Guys, I echo Pens words. More specifically:

Jnr Channel:

Not necessary.. While we can all apreciate them being young this is "big boy" gaming and  they are excitable little chaps so they will chatter on a bit more than  necessary. Not too much more than Sulky does in Arma 2 I imagine. :narnar:
 
 One of the great things about this community is mutual respect and  politeness. If a dMw junior is carrying on too much, they should be  politely told to keep the chatter down and not a "play by play" of what  they are doing / seeing. Remember that this is a learning environment  and these are young gamers. If we tell them nicely and politely to calm  down our quieten down, they should do so.

Most importantly, dMw standards must apply.
 
 We allow them to play as they have demonstrated maturity and  understanding of the "dMw way". Or at the very least they are willing to  learn it.
 
 The Tag:

The dMw tag must be earned for each game that we support. While the Game  Leader awards the badge at their discression, the standards as set out  by the community must apply.

The dMw tag is to be Respected and also Can Be Taken Away.

I like most of the admins and definately the community leaders have  worked hard to get here and I'll be damned if I'll make it "easier" for  others by letting the standards slip.

Again, giving out tags is down to the GL's decision but remember getting  a tag in one game does not give you an open invitation to wear it  everywhere and in every game.

One thing the tag is not is a dMw Community Member tag.

While we will always make room for community members and welcome them and expect them in teamspeak, the dMw tag is earned and granted by the Game Leader.

I don't want to cause anyone any offence but if we let the standards slip then we lose what we have worked so hard for.

NF

[TwoBad]

Cricky, i didn't quite expect such a big reaction to this, thought it would be a little more yay or nay. However, it is good to hear the views of everyone.
 
I think i've not been as clear as i could have been.
 
I love having the Juniors on TS and i would prefer for them to stay at all time on the main channel. My two are very aware of how TS works as we run our own server for home gaming and it was actually their idea for a separate channel. Initially i said no but after two weeks of nagging (as kids do) i said i would post a question about it.
 
The reason i decided to post is, as i said, a couple of times adult player have said about the amount or loudness of their chat. Maybe they didn't feel they could say anything at the time the Juniors were on. I have no problem with anyone asking my boys to take it down a peg or two.
 
I also remember one occasion when a Junior was being quite vocal but as they all do trying to be as helpful as they can. One of the adult players asked for ammo and the Junior answered with "I have some, where are you". They continued to ask where are you etc for quite some time with no response. Again, no problem from me but some players could be annoyed at that. As it turned out, the adult play had muted the Junior.

If a dMw junior is carrying on too much, they should be politely told to keep the chatter down and not a "play by play" of what they are doing / seeing. Remember that this is a learning environment and these are young gamers. If we tell them nicely and politely to calm down our quieten down, they should do so..

So provided we all do this i see no reason to have a separate channel
 
As for the TAG. Sorry, i wasn't clear about what i was saying at all. I fully understand that the dMw. is a game tag for BC2. I know it can only be earned by playing to the standards expected. I was very pleased to be awarded it and i know i could loose the right to wear it if i fall below the standards expected. My boys also know this is a given privilege which has to be earned. They asked me when they could wear it and i told them in no uncertain terms it would only be awarded to them WHEN they had shown the attributes required, Attitude, Teamwork and Fairplay. But it does identify them as having done that.
 
As for the LAN, i would never dream of bring kids to it. It is very obviously an adult event. My comment about telling my wife is just a reference to her trying to be funny telling me now that the boys play i can take them and she can have the weekend to her self. My wife and i have lots of fun trying to wind each other up like that all the time. My mum hates it as she thinks we're about to devoice when ever she see us doing it.
 
So, to summarise my ample ramberlings above. Provided other dMw player are happy to tell the Juniors when they do get a bit too chatty then GREAT! Lets stick with what we have.

[Penfold]

Cricky, i didn't quite expect such a big reaction to this

Nps. It only that there's a long and pitted history surrounding this subject. Back in the old days it could literally take years for someone to be invited into 'Charlie' Company and to be allowed to wear a badge. It was a very hierarchical system with clearly defined tiers of membership and you had to be nominated and seconded and then shadowed on the server etc. Admins had to go to 'Admin School' where they had to pass a 'course'. IIRC it took me five years to make Charlie status!

Then we had what I lovingly refer to as Ninja-Gate and we totally restructured everything from the top down and came up with the new system of vertical levels of autonomy. This included things such as Section Admins and Game Leaders and a new much more inclusive style of badges and membership.

The single biggest fear that the Community came back at us was a fear of the dilution of our gaming standards and ethos and the strict guidelines which is so ingrained in us. It makes us who we are and it makes members want to stay with us. It still is.....For example, of the back off this thread alone we've had people saying, for example, "but the very fact a request has been made to move them to another dedicated channel throws up a warning sign that something is not right."

New blood is great, nay, it is vital for us to survive but it's a balance between the old and the new and the wants and needs of the older members and the new generation coming through.

Anyway, on the whole the Community is rightly tolerant and encouraging of 2nd generation players coming through - after all, we're used to having offspring play with their parents - OldBloke+Frenzy, Blunt+Toxteth etc and it's a great and worthwhile thing and long may it continue. Watching kids whip their parents (and everyone else) is  hilarious .

PS.

Here are a couple of long and boring threads about the latest change and the history and the reiteration of the importance of standards:

http://www.deadmen.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?28178-New-Management-Structure
http://www.deadmen.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?25329-Community-Changes