VAT on SC Stuff

[Gorion]

Even on digital goods now.

I'll be blunt, not interested in backing, and being charged VAT for it; especially if the USD backing price won't be equal to EUR in value.

[albert]

Well a VPN and PayPal account should get around that problem if US$ pricing is the main objective.

I would hope that the UK to US exchange rate over a reasonable period with a fair average exchange rate will be used to make the value to the goods comparable and we have it corrected for VAT so that what you pay in UK with VAT equals mostly what you pay in the US with state tax.

If they charge internationals in real terms more than US folks then WOW, backlash time!

[Galatoni]

Aye. Its things like this that are going to force people to start genuinely looking at something online thats equivalent to a Swiss bank account for internet purchases.

[Chaosphere]

Well a VPN and PayPal account should get around that problem if US$ pricing is the main objective.

I would hope that the UK to US exchange rate over a reasonable period with a fair average exchange rate will be used to make the value to the goods comparable and we have it corrected for VAT so that what you pay in UK with VAT equals mostly what you pay in the US with state tax.

If they charge internationals in real terms more than US folks then WOW, backlash time!

PayPal can be funny with VPNs, they have blocked my account twice in the past due to it being used over VPN (for security reasons of course). Easy enough to fix but requires fairly lengthy phone calls which is a bit of a pain...

[TeaLeaf]

Well a VPN and PayPal account should get around that problem if US$ pricing is the main objective.

Haven't there been a reasonable number of Paypal accounts suspended/terminated due to VPN use?

[TeaLeaf]

Interesting reading, perhaps they have been mis-banned?

The linked Archived PayPal Community post you show seems inaccurate. The Adminstrator's reply links only to the broad page showing PayPal Legal Agreements (https://www.paypal.com/webapps/mpp/ua/legalhub-full?country.x=US&locale.x=en_US) and does not specify where in any of the listed documents proxy use is against PayPal's terms.
 
I thoroughly read through PayPal's entire User Agreement, Privacy Policy, Acceptable Use Policy, Electronic Communications Delivery Policy, Infringement Report Policy, Anti-Money Laundering and Counter-Terrorist Financing Statementand Policy Updates. Only one mention of "proxies" or "proxy" was in any of these documents.
 
The reference is in the User Agreement (version from Feb 25th, 2014). This is from Section 9: Restricted Activities, sub-section 9.1, item (q):
 
   Section 9.1 Title:
"9.1 Restricted Activities. In connection with your use of our website, your Account, the PayPal Services, or in the course of your interactions with PayPal, other Users, or third parties, you will not:"
 
"q. Take any action that imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on our infrastructure; facilitate any viruses, Trojan horses, worms or other computer programming routines that may damage, detrimentally interfere with, surreptitiously intercept or expropriate any system, data or Information; use an anonymizing proxy; use any robot, spider, other automatic device, or manual process to monitor or copy our website without our prior written permission; or use any device, software or routine to bypass our robot exclusion headers, or interfere or attempt to interfere with our website or the PayPal Services;"
 
This only bans anonymyzing proxies, not all proxies. Further more, VPNs are not proxies - the technology is completely different. Even if this statement banned all uses of proxies (which it does not) it would not imply any ban on VPNs within PayPal's User Agreement.
 
So, it would not appear that use of VPNs or non-anonymizing proxies for accessing PayPal for legitimate purposes is in any way against the terms and conditions. Perhaps the legal agreements have changed since the Administrator's post in 2011?
 
Howver, I suspect that the VPNs and/or proxies might be triggering fraud monitoring/fraud detection tools. That might be where the additional security issues come in?

https://uwnthesis.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/paypal-terminated-my-account-because-use-of-a-vpn-is-against-their-terms-and-conditions/

[TeaLeaf]

...anyway, the good news buriewd in that post was this:

We are informing you today, with two weeks before the switch on Feb 1, in case you have been waiting to purchase a ship or package at the current rates. By popular request, we will make a selection of limited edition and wave two ships available again during the week of January 26, in case there’s a past favorite you missed out on and would like to pick up before the international publishing switches over to RSI. Please check this space on the 26th for a list of available ships.

[Gorion]

Well, everyone who wanted one probably has one of those ships already.

Then we get shafted on everything else from February, and we're donating.  I don't plan to spend another dime, unless they arrange their EU prices to reflect the additional tax imposed when compared to US donations.

[TeaLeaf]

Not sure I agree with that.   The tax is EU, not US and other US states have their own laws to pay tax as mentioned in the article.   If you want to buy more then do, just buy the equivalent VAT amount less from an EU shop to smooth over your conscience!

[albert]

In the end the price the consumer pays is what counts. New pledgers from Europe will look and see the difference, try to buy through the US store, fail probably if CIG do this right and not buy.

I suspect this is being forced upon CIG as the Europeans want their share or tax earnings for their population. I completely understand the situation as I deal with it every day.

It comes down to the pledge vs the product argument again and what the value of digital goods are.

[Galatoni]

People already pay this, already. Its a shame that we've not had to do it, however, the only things in life are certain, its death and taxes.

A positive to take from this is that CR will try and force the next concept out to be the most (suspected) popular amongst the remaining ships. He'll do the sale as a last hazzar and then, I think he knows, that will virtually wrap up expensive ships being on sale. :2cents:

[BrotherTobious]

Well I folded and brought my 2nd ship.  Must now say 100 Hail Chris Roberts!!!!

[OldBloke]

Elite has you hooked on lugging boxes around the 'verse I see :thumb:

[BrotherTobious]

Don't at least this thing I brought has the illusion of being able to turn.

Sent from my Nexus 5

[Galatoni]

Quick update in case anyone missed it. The sale has been extended to include the Reclaimer and the Carrack.