Announcement

[Vargen]

Attendance Problem
The Officers have identified an attendance problem recently (particularly but not exclusively within RG1) and have monitored attendance now for several months.  The survey issued to members in early May provided feedback that attendance was due to improve dramatically in early/mid June and this has not happened as we still have attendance problems.  

Attendance Action
We are writing to all those RG1 members who are failing to meet the attendance requirements and will ask them to either improve their attendance with immediate effect or to request a change in Guild rank.  If no response is forthcoming we will write to them one final time and warn that a non-response will lead to the loss of their Guardian rank so that we can resolve the attendance issue.  Those unable to meet attendance requirement will be politely removed from RG1.

RG1 Attendance Requirement
RG1 sets high raid standards and as such we feel that now is the right time to raise the bar.  We are now asking all Guardian members to meet a higher attendance standard to help us plan successful raids.  Details will be announced shortly and if you anticipate having any trouble meeting these standards then please let us know immediately so that we can discuss your position with you.

RG2 Attendance Requirement
Due to the problems experienced RG2 is now considering whether or not to bring in some form of attendance requirement.  Officers are currently discussing this and more information will follow shortly.

Raid Holiday â€" RG1 & RG2
Many members are meeting up for the week beginning Saterday 1st July and we are therefore suspending all 40 person raiding activity for the period Sunday 2nd July to Thursday 6th July inclusive.  40 person instance raiding will resume on Sunday 9th July 2006.

RG1 Recruitment
As RG2 develops the Officers have identified that one of the threats to RG2’s progress is that RG1 will periodically ‘steal’ RG2’s best raiders when RG1 has any openings.  This will impact upon RG2 stability and progress and is not fair on other RG2  members.  Whilst this ‘sharing’ of members between raid groups has worked well for us to date we are now of the opinion that we need to provide RG2 with more stability.  With this in mind we are considering opening RG1 recruitment to non-Guild members (instead of RG2 members only) and increasing the requirements for any new RG1 member significantly. The precise requirements are to be decided and more information will follow.

The Officers have spent considerable time discussing the above and we hope that the information provided helps explain the action we are taking to solve the attendance problems and to help both raid groups progress further through the end-game instances.

Vargen
Guild Master

[Mazii]

RG2 Attendance Requirement
Due to the problems experienced RG2 is now considering whether or not to bring in some form of attendance requirement. Officers are currently discussing this and more information will follow shortly.

Agree on that term! We need a stable raid group, and having new people on every raid is simply not good, as it slows our progress very much down!

Raid Holiday â€" RG1 & RG2
Many members are meeting up for the week beginning Sunday 2nd July and we are therefore suspending all raiding activity for the period Sunday 2nd July to Thursday 6th July inclusive. Raiding will resume on Sunday 9th July 2006.

What about a MC run with RG1 and RG2 combined?

RG1 Recruitment
As RG2 develops the Officers have identified that one of the threats to RG2’s progress is that RG1 will periodically ‘steal’ RG2’s best raiders when RG1 has any openings. This will impact upon RG2 stability and progress and is not fair on other RG2 members. Whilst this ‘sharing’ of members between raid groups has worked well for us to date we are now of the opinion that we need to provide RG2 with more stability. With this in mind we are considering opening RG1 recruitment to non-Guild members (instead of RG2 members only) and increasing the requirements for any new RG1 member significantly. The precise requirements are to be decided and more information will follow.

I have been looking forward to this! This means RG2 wont loose there best players to RG1 as soon as a spot opens, because this are the people we need in exactly our Raidgroup! And we allready lost some good members of that.

I'm very satisfied with all the subjects regarding RG2, and for the RG1 subject about attendance, I feel it's the right thing to do!

[Sebas]

I must say, I totally agree on all points with Mazii. It doesnt feel fair if because RG1 lacks the attendance RG2 must also suffer from it because several of the better equipped raiders will become Guardians.

And why not a combined raid for once as Mazii suggested. There can be enough to atleast fill one raid to Molten Core and why not do that. Not that it will have much effect on me, because I'll be in Norway for a vacation

[Luthor]

Signed Vargen... nice to hear some announcements from the officer group , so we actually know action is being taken.

About the RG1 vs. RG2, well if the player in RG2 have a wish to join RG1, why should that player not be considered if there is an opening? if i were in RG2 and would like to raid more, but not able to join RG1 because of rules, i might be willing to get a new guild, one that would support my desire for mroe raids. is it only me that see it that way?

But there should also be considered "outsiders" for those seats, but maybe looking at the gear and specc people got, should the invite or upgrade be made?

Maybe this stuff is already being taken into, consideration if so, im sorry...

[Mazii]

Originally posted by Luthor@Jun 25 2006, 10:14 PM
About the RG1 vs. RG2, well if the player in RG2 have a wish to join RG1, why should that player not be considered if there is an opening? if i were in RG2 and would like to raid more, but not able to join RG1 because of rules, i might be willing to get a new guild, one that would support my desire for mroe raids. is it only me that see it that way?

[post=133419]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

If people wish to raid more and are just waiting for a spot in RG1 to open, I don't think they should be in RG2. We need people who are willing to build up a good raid group, not people who are all in about the loot. Ofcourse everybody wants better loot, and before you can get that you need to take down harder bosses and we need people who know eachother for that, not people who leave as soon as a little better offer pops up.

Don't know if it makes sence in your ears, but in mine it does  :blink:

[Sazgul]

I like to post Vargen, very much.

And btw.
Vargen did not state that RG2 members couldn't apply for RG1 spots.

[Mazii]

But if you do, remember that you, in a kind of a way, are letting RG2 down.

[Asmoden]

Originally posted by Luthor+Jun 25 2006, 09:14 PM-->

QUOTE(Luthor @ Jun 25 2006, 09:14 PM)

About the RG1 vs. RG2, well if the player in RG2 have a wish to join RG1, why should that player not be considered if there is an opening? if i were in RG2 and would like to raid more, but not able to join RG1 because of rules, i might be willing to get a new guild, one that would support my desire for mroe raids. is it only me that see it that way?

[post=133419]Quoted post[/post]

[/b]

No Luthor, you are not alone :-)
The main reson i joined SoG from our old guild (Northern Guards) was because i wanted to try the bigger instances. I have played these kinds of games a lot of year now, but i have never been up there with the "elites" and tried the best. I dont want the loot (thats only er perk ). What i want is whiping a gazilion times on firemaw like you guy's did. I want to try places where people havent really been before and explore stuff... thats what i want.

Another reson i think this is a "bad" idea, is that i think it will split the guild. As it is right now, there is the >old< people, and the new once. Atm, unless you socialise, you wont meet people who are not in your own raidgroup. You can however get lucky and join an RG1 raid and meet some people as it is right now.
If you close the joining of RG2 - RG1, you might as well make 2 guilds. The two groups would work apart, recruit apart, have different leaders, make different raids and be two totaly different places in the game. The only thing we would really share was officers, and a guild chat.
I dont know if that was the original point of RG2, but if it was i must have gone wrong somewhere.

[Mazii]

Originally posted by Asmoden+Jun 25 2006, 10:50 PM-->

QUOTE(Asmoden @ Jun 25 2006, 10:50 PM)

Another reson i think this is a "bad" idea, is that i think it will split the guild. As it is right now, there is the >old< people, and the new once. Atm, unless you socialise, you wont meet people who are not in your own raidgroup. You can however get lucky and join an RG1 raid and meet some people as it is right now.[/b]

In the future you wont be able to join RG1 raids. When RG2 will begin in BWL it simply can't happen. However there are still loads of oppotunities to socialise. ZG/AQ raids, 5- and 10-man partys, world bosses, things like the invasion and just being a part of the guild chat.

Originally posted by Asmoden@Jun 25 2006, 10:50 PM
Another reson i think this is a "bad" idea, is that i think it will split the guild. As it is right now, there is the >old< people, and the new once. Atm, unless you socialise, you wont meet people who are not in your own raidgroup. You can however get lucky and join an RG1 raid and meet some people as it is right now.
If you close the joining of RG2 - RG1, you might as well make 2 guilds. The two groups would work apart, recruit apart, have different leaders, make different raids and be two totaly different places in the game. The only thing we would really share was officers, and a guild chat.
I dont know if that was the original point of RG2, but if it was i must have gone wrong somewhere.

I can only talk for myself, and what I think the Officers decision on having a RG2.

When they where only 1 raidgroup, they couldnt gather enough people for the 20-man instances now we can (though we have had some slacking lately). Furthermore they have given some people a chance to see end game instances.

[Sebas]

Asmoden, why do you want to go to RG1? Well wiping on new bosses, but thats what we're are about to do because I dont think that the first tries on BWL are that far away for RG2. So you want big repair bills, get them here

And yeah, only taking members from RG2 to fill up RG1 is for me not the way to go

[Nefrion]

I think its nice to see these improvements being made and not just discussed. I am proud to be a part of a dynamic guild that listens to its members and acts on the input they bring.

I have not attended a raid for a whole month now due to computer problems. I just opened my account yesterday and are looking forward to tonight's raid.

Again, nice to see the officers take action on things being discussed.

[DonnieKingo]

Hi,

I would just like to add my two cents - even though its the same as what Mazii wrote.

I liked what i read in Vargens post - and i find it to be the right thing to do.

It has been a constant threat to RG2 that once there was a spot on RG1 the best equipped players would apply and leave RG2 behind. If that was their desire - well best of luck to you - but that leaves the rest of us in state where we cant progress as fast as we would like to.

When the best players leave RG2 we have to get new players to join - and that often mean players that are not experinced in MC and sure as hell arent as good equipped as the ones we loose. So once again we are forced to take a step back and try again - and thats pretty frustrating.

We have taken down Raggy twice now - and i would like to hope that he soon becomes a regular kill. There are plenty of challenges i RG2 if that is what yo seek. Before we even try our luck in BWL i would like to see us clear MC in one night - and i think that requires a bit more epic gear on RG2 members - but i can only speak for myself

So once again - i can say i liked the post.

-DonnieKingo

[Greatdanes]

I think all class leader from RG2 can agree with you Mazii and nice to see this post in public forums. Applause to Vargen / The officers.

One of the goal with RG2 is/must be to make it a independent raid group so when a member leave for RG1 it is a big step back for RG2. It will so nice if that stops.

Let us try to make a common raid group during the holidays so people back home can do something fun.

[Zabard]

Well, as others have added their two cents, here's mine.

Like Asmoden, I am hoping to join RG1 for a free spot there as well. Some might think of this as "abandoning ship" or whatnot, but I have my reasons as well.

First off, the reason I didn't apply for RG1 as soon as I joined the guild, was that I hadn't been to MC or any of the "end game" instances before, and frankly thought I might get bored with it if I ran in there all the time. I've found that it is anything but boring, and would like to do it more often. RG2's "twice a week" is, as far as I see it, not enough. If we're going to get to BWL, AQ40 or the new Naxx instance, it's going to take ages. I play a lot (probably too much), and think that most of you have seen this through my attandance in both MC, ZG and AQ. I've tried to join BWL several times, but appart from a couple of times ages ago, someone else have gotten the free spot(s).

So you can say that I don't "support" RG2 by wanting to join RG1, but as I am looking for even more "effort" from my fellow raiders and more raid days per week, I guess the only way is by joining RG1. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I suppose RG2 will always stay as a twice a week thing.

Jemeny da  :ph34r:

[Bastet]

Note, that its not impossible for you to join, and that these things still need some work, mainly in talking with rg2 leaders.